Islamic Thinkers at Israel Day in New York

[Brother_Mujahid]

http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/4193/20080603israeldaynyke6.jpg

The worshipers of Israel and self-hating goyim were quite upset by this, but I thought some of their posters were quite witty and humorous:

http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/article/30172_Islamic_Thinkers_at_Israel_Day_in_New_York

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/9922/cimg0273ik6.jpg

[Abd al-Haqq Marshall]

Wish I could have been there.

[Salahadeen]

[FONT="Palatino Linotype"][CENTER]http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/4193/20080603israeldaynyke6.jpg

The worshipers of Israel and self-hating goyim were quite upset by this, but I thought some of their posters were quite witty and humorous:


Can I ask you, Brother Mujahid, what is the point of rallies? Is it not to win hearts and minds?

Do you think that many hearts and minds are won by such a poster (i.e. the 'cheap murderous apes' one)?

[Intoodeep]

Can I ask you, Brother Mujahid, what is the point of rallies? Is it not to win hearts and minds?

Do you think that many hearts and minds are won by such a poster (i.e. the 'cheap murderous apes' one)?

c'mon, how long we gonna practice Taqiyyah, You know thats how the majority of us think anyways.

BTW, if you got a better way, go and do it. dont just criticise. i hate arm-chair cowardly critics.

[Salahadeen]

c'mon, how long we gonna practice Taqiyyah, You know thats how the majority of us think anyways.

I don't think it is taqiyyah. That poster is not very Islamic to begin with. First off, there is a picture, which is haram. Second of all, it is a racist and crude drawing.

As for what "the majority of us think", I don't think Islamic Thinkers and their cohorts represent what the majority of Muslims think at all. There are only a handful of people that are a part of this extremist and misguided takfeeri organization. Hopefully, most of us think that not all Jews are evil, as Allah [swt] says in the Quran that "not all of them are alike".


BTW, if you got a better way, go and do it.

I've been involved in the dawah about the Palestine issue before. I've written articles on the topic, been to debates, etc. So yeah, I'm already doing that. But thanks for your concern.

dont just criticise. i hate arm-chair cowardly critics.

The question is: what have YOU done?

Anyways, MY question is: what purpose did this poster serve? The purpose of a rally is to win hearts and minds. If you say 'we don't care about hearts and minds', then what the hell are you doing at a protest/rally to begin with!? Is it just a place to vent your anger?

Such Muslims do more harm than good. People already think that we are a murderous and racist people; the Islamaphobes seek to demonize us, and such Muslims help that process.

When the press covers this rally ,all they will focus on is that poster...instead of taking home the message that Israel is committing an atrocity against our people.

If you want to do some REAL damage to the opposition, then we should call the Anti-Zionist orthodox Jews to rallies...there is NOTHING that burns the Israeli supporters more than this, just like we Muslims hate it when they keep promoting Muslim apostates.

Dawah is a part of Jihad nowadays. It is a war of hearts and minds...an ideological war between Islam and Kufr, between Truth and falsehoods. Our dawah must be precise...dawah must be done in such a way to exact maximum damage to Kufr...

At our rallies back in the day, the Zionists used to infiltrate pro-Palestine rallies...a Zionist Jew used to dress up as a Muslim, and wave outrageous placards filled with anti-Semitic racist rhetoric...so imagine how much the Zionist Jews must be thanking this Muslim for waving this racist poster in the air. He is doing them a service!

By the way, the other poster is nice...the one about Israeli army leaving leaving 4.6 million cluster bombs...as for the poster with the Nazi picture of the Jew, then that is just bravado, not bravery.

May Allah [swt] aid us to liberate Al-Quds.

[Intoodeep]

I don't think it is taqiyyah. That poster is not very Islamic to begin with. First off, there is a picture, which is haram. Second of all, it is a racist and crude drawing.

Theres a difference of opinion on pictures. Nothing haram in it from what i can tell.

I don't think Islamic Thinkers and their cohorts represent what the majority of Muslims think at all. There are only a handful of people that are a part of this extremist and misguided takfeeri organization.
that applies more so to you and your semi-madhkalite cohorts. How many people have you got behind you, and look how divided they are. On top of that you and the people you represent have NO social standing whatsoever.
Ask the ummah at large and over 90% of them will think like this of the Yahood (right or wrong)

Hopefully, most of us think that not all Jews are evil, as Allah [swt] says in the Quran that "not all of them are alike".
Yes not all jews are evil, but the poster didnt say all jews did it?? It was geared towards the israeli zionists. Its YOU who is extrapolating and making something else of what they say. Also plenty of verses in the Quran talk about the emnity of the Yahood.


Such Muslims do more harm than good. People already think that we are a murderous and racist people; the Islamaphobes seek to demonize us, and such Muslims help that process.

You will NEVER win the kuffar over. They dont give two hoots about the palestinains and they NEVER will. So let them do this, what more harm can possibly happen to the palestinians which isnt already happening. Cant you see how one-sided the conflict already is.

If you got a better plan to convince the kuffar let me see it. While your at it think of a way to counter the growing Christian zionist movements etc too. From what i can see, all these years of your dawah full of 'hikmah' have not only led nowhere, but the situation has gotten from bad to Worse.

[Salahadeen]

Theres a difference of opinion on pictures. Nothing haram in it from what i can tell.

From what you can tell? And you are...?

Drawing pictures of living creatures is definitely haram. The only difference of opinion that people have is over photographs. But what does your kind care about prohibitions? I mean, you guys can take the life of civilians--women and children--so what would stop you from drawing some pictures?

that applies more so to you and your semi-madhkalite cohorts. How many people have you got behind you, and look how divided they are. On top of that you and the people you represent have NO social standing whatsoever.

No social standing? Your kind has to hide in caves. Talk about social standing. Your kind isn't even allowed in the Islamic universities. Your people are scrubs who try defrauding the government to get welfare handouts. Talk about social standing!

Ask the ummah at large and over 90% of them will think like this of the Yahood (right or wrong)

Actually, Gallop Poll took a poll representative of 1 billion Muslims and found the exact opposite reaction. 85-90% of Muslims are considered 'moderate', whereas only 10% are radical like yourself.

You will NEVER win the kuffar over. They dont give two hoots about the palestinains and they NEVER will.

I've already dealt with this, but your half-wit brain couldn't comprehend this point. If you think you can NEVER win the kufaar over, then why are you at this rally/protest to begin with!? Just to pass the time? Vent a bit? If you think that they will never give two hoots and never will, then WHY ARE YOU AT THE RALLY WITH THAT POSTER IN THE FIRST PLACE!? By your own admission, it can never have any benefit!

[tayfah_mansurah]

lol, guess these let are more creative with their posters unlike the muhajiroun/ghuraba dudes in UK, better than bomb bomb uk posters :rolleyes: what a joke

http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/4193/20080603israeldaynyke6.jpg

The worshipers of Israel and self-hating goyim were quite upset by this, but I thought some of their posters were quite witty and humorous:

http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/article/30172_Islamic_Thinkers_at_Israel_Day_in_New_York

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/9922/cimg0273ik6.jpg

[AbiSalahuddin]

Lesson no.1 for Jaysh

In Islam there is something called baraa'. These najis Jews were celebrating 60 years of establishing their state from Palestinian land. So yes, they are against Muslims. But you, well, maybe they would make an exception and love you. So these brothers were showing their hatred for these Jews that were celebrating their stolen land and the blood spilt of Muslim brothers and sisters. They needed to be condemned. I'd rather be loved by what you class as 'terrorists' in Iraq and Afghanistan than be loved by kuffaar, Alhamdulillah.

Furthermore, these brothers have more support than you know, so don't babble on with your lies, jazaakAllah.

P.S. I hope the word 'najis' didn't hurt your heart filled with nifaaq tooo much.

[Intoodeep]

No social standing? Your kind has to hide in caves. Talk about social standing. Your kind isn't even allowed in the Islamic universities. Your people are scrubs who try defrauding the government to get welfare handouts. Talk about social standing!

??? im not hiding anywhere, and nor were these brothers. the only one hiding is you - and thats behind a computer screen. BTW what kind of lunatic level are you on ?? does everyone who disagree with you happen to be AL QAEDA hiding in caves (btw i didnt know the had 'net access there!) !!

Actually, Gallop Poll took a poll representative of 1 billion Muslims and found the exact opposite reaction. 85-90% of Muslims are considered 'moderate', whereas only 10% are radical like yourself.

Gallup poll on what the Yahood. wheres the evidence. How am i 'radical' ! almost all the scholars have similiar views in private to myself. - and beleive me i have helped out and been in private sittings with lots of them.

I've already dealt with this, but your half-wit brain couldn't comprehend this point. If you think you can NEVER win the kufaar over, then why are you at this rally/protest to begin with!? Just to pass the time? Vent a bit? If you think that they will never give two hoots and never will, then WHY ARE YOU AT THE RALLY WITH THAT POSTER IN THE FIRST PLACE!? By your own admission, it can never have any benefit!

You havent dealt with anything. and they only dim-witted person around here is you, who cant see the wood for the trees and believes every1 who differs from his (very deviant) opinions is a terrorist! what a joke.

BTW like i said if you have noticed any other method having any effect then please enlighten us. We are open minded, unlike bigoted people who use western morals and feelings as a criteria for dawah.

[Salahadeen]

IntooDeep,

Answer the question. Stop avoiding it.

What is the purpose of Muslims staging a protest or rally?

Is not the point to win hearts and minds? My argument is that if you really think that the kufaar can never be won over, then why are you even coming to the protest or rally, since the point of it is to win hearts and minds!?

If there is some other point to attending the rally, then please do let me know!

But you cannot answer this point so you keep doing spin!

[Salahadeen]

Lesson no.1 for Jaysh

In Islam there is something called baraa'. These najis Jews were celebrating 60 years of establishing their state from Palestinian land. So yes, they are against Muslims. But you, well, maybe they would make an exception and love you. So these brothers were showing their hatred for these Jews that were celebrating their stolen land and the blood spilt of Muslim brothers and sisters. They needed to be condemned. I'd rather be loved by what you class as 'terrorists' in Iraq and Afghanistan than be loved by kuffaar, Alhamdulillah.

Furthermore, these brothers have more support than you know, so don't babble on with your lies, jazaakAllah.

P.S. I hope the word 'najis' didn't hurt your heart filled with nifaaq tooo much.

I support Palestine. I support the complete eradication of Israel. I reject a two state solution. I believe that every single square inch of Palestine is ours. I demand not only a return of the Palestinian land but reparations for the years of brutality that our people have suffered. And I say: LONG LIVE THE INTIFADA!

I also have hatred for the Zionists and their supporters. So why not shut your filthy mouth, instead of accusing my heart of being full of nifaaq. You fool, do you see inside the hearts!? The Prophet [s] KNEW who the munaafiqeen were and he still didn't take action against them. Yet, you have no problem in claiming that I have nifaaq in my heart.

All because I reject Al-Qaeda, suddenly I have nifaaq in my heart. You utter fool.

Anyways, you cannot answer the point I raised in my previous post, you blathering idiot.

[Abu Abdallah al-Bulghari]

Da'wah is not when a person likes everything you say, Da'wah is about the opposite: things the person does not like: death, punishment in Hell after death, all the topics that are uncomfortable.

"Islam is peace" Da'wah is a Sufi Da'wah, deviation Da'wah. Allah is peace, not Islam. Islam is submission, submission 100% of time whether you like it or not. And most people do not like it.

Like Quraish were brainwashed by idol-worshipping propaganda, the modern Westerners are brainwashed by Jew-hugging, Jew-sympathizing ideology.

[AbiSalahuddin]

I said, when referring to you, 'heart filled with nifaaq' while my heart did not intend 'filled'. So I do not know why I wrote this. I apologize. This is my mistake.

I will reply to the rest of the post later.

[Salahadeen]

Da'wah is not when a person likes everything you say, Da'wah is about the opposite: things the person does not like: death, punishment in Hell after death, all the topics that are uncomfortable.

"Islam is peace" Da'wah is a Sufi Da'wah, deviation Da'wah. Allah is peace, not Islam. Islam is submission, submission 100% of time whether you like it or not. And most people do not like it.

Like Quraish were brainwashed by idol-worshipping propaganda, the modern Westerners are brainwashed by Jew-hugging, Jew-sympathizing ideology.

So you honestly--as Allah [swt] as your witness--can say that this poster would be beneficial to dawah? You think it would make someone say: 'hey, I want to become Muslim." Other than a few Neo-Nazis, who do you think would harken to such a message?

Reply honestly please. No lying.

Nobody is saying that you have to say "islam is peace"...you could use a poster with a sword and kalimah, with a saying of Salahadeen or saying something like 'God will send us another Salahadeen'....or some powerful image like that, which would show Islam as a strong religion, and Muslims as a people willing to defend their kind. But to use a racist picture, do you think this has any benefit?

Again, answer honestly.

[Intoodeep]

What is the purpose of Muslims staging a protest or rally?

Is not the point to win hearts and minds? My argument is that if you really think that the kufaar can never be won over, then why are you even coming to the protest or rally, since the point of it is to win hearts and minds!?

Thats not the only reason you may hold a protest or Rally. It can be to expose another side/angle to a debate and highlight it or it can be to take people out of their 'comfort zones' to make them question what they believe to be right or wrong. It can also be to show your disapproval for something. When all people have seen is how good israel is etc then they wont know the brutal methods and techniques the zionist entity uses to maintain control. These kind of actions can highlight those.
There are many reasons..dont look at things so shallowly.

Like i said there is nothing wrong at all with what they did.

Nobody is saying that you have to say "islam is peace"...you could use a poster with a sword and kalimah, with a saying of Salahadeen or saying something like 'God will send us another Salahadeen'....or some powerful image like that, which would show Islam as a strong religion, and Muslims as a people willing to defend their kind. But to use a racist picture, do you think this has any benefit?

Wheres the queues of converts this poster is preventing??? i see none. It is Allah who guides not you or me. Who knows this may have more of a beneficial impact then u think.

[Nu7]

Even 9/11 had a positive impact on the rate of conversions. So yeah, Hidayah comes from Allah, 'Azza wa Jal, alone.

[abumuwahid]

I am not into protests at all especially the loud mouthed ones like they used to have in Lonodon, where the brothers actually end up getting arrested.

But these bros in New York seem to be a bit more level headed and this keeps them going so why criticise them for no reason.

[Ibn malik]

IntooDeep,

Answer the question. Stop avoiding it.

What is the purpose of Muslims staging a protest or rally?

Is not the point to win hearts and minds? My argument is that if you really think that the kufaar can never be won over, then why are you even coming to the protest or rally, since the point of it is to win hearts and minds!?

If there is some other point to attending the rally, then please do let me know!

But you cannot answer this point so you keep doing spin!
Actually rallies are not just to win over poeple, they can be held for the sole reason of expressing dissent.

In any case, how do you know this will not win over certain groups of people? Take for example young street guys who see this; they will probably see the funny side to it. I agree that these are in bad taste, but these are directed towards the worste criminals on this Earth, who have transgressed all bounds of decency and diologue.

I ask Allah to destroy the tyrants who have brutalised our brothers and sisters!

[Abu Abdallah al-Bulghari]

So you honestly--as Allah [swt] as your witness--can say that this poster would be beneficial to dawah? You think it would make someone say: 'hey, I want to become Muslim." Other than a few Neo-Nazis, who do you think would harken to such a message?

Reply honestly please. No lying.

Nobody is saying that you have to say "islam is peace"...you could use a poster with a sword and kalimah, with a saying of Salahadeen or saying something like 'God will send us another Salahadeen'....or some powerful image like that, which would show Islam as a strong religion, and Muslims as a people willing to defend their kind. But to use a racist picture, do you think this has any benefit?

Again, answer honestly.

Brother, I do not appreciate your tone of mentioning my honesty. Have I have said anything that allows you to question my honesty?

Now, the answer:

It is simple as this. We tell the truth. It is up to them to accept it or not by Allah's will. How many will benefit and who would they be - I do not know. And you do not know either.

[AbiSalahuddin]

I support Palestine. I support the complete eradication of Israel. I reject a two state solution. I believe that every single square inch of Palestine is ours. I demand not only a return of the Palestinian land but reparations for the years of brutality that our people have suffered. And I say: LONG LIVE THE INTIFADA!

I also have hatred for the Zionists and their supporters. So why not shut your filthy mouth, instead of accusing my heart of being full of nifaaq. You fool, do you see inside the hearts!? The Prophet [s] KNEW who the munaafiqeen were and he still didn't take action against them. Yet, you have no problem in claiming that I have nifaaq in my heart.

All because I reject Al-Qaeda, suddenly I have nifaaq in my heart. You utter fool.

Anyways, you cannot answer the point I raised in my previous post, you blathering idiot.
As for your support of Palestine, then you should know that it is built upon sooo many suicide bombers, so now what? The only group that doesn't support suicide bombing is Fatah, the secularist group. Though Hamas (the political wing) doesn't seem too far from secularism as things currently stand. In fact Hamas even attacks non-combatants! Well, this is kind of questionable because all receive military training, but yes. I personally don't agree with Al-Qa'eda in totality, as I do not agree with the targetting of non-combatants and a very few of their attacks which are careless in their precision, thus killing Muslims. But this is another issue where Murtadeen (who are worse than kuffar) use Muslims as their shields.

As for nifaaq, then the word I should have used was 'loaded with nifaaq' but to say 'filled' may be misconstrued as having nothing but nifaaq. So you have nifaaq, and as for your ignorance on this matter, then the Munafiq is to be exposed, since the revelation is complete, Alhamdulillah. But what shows your total ignorance is that nifaaq does not equal Munafiq. Just as shirk asghar and ar-riya do not equal Mushrik. So please, do your homework before you speak brother.

My opinion of you has nothing to do with you rejecting Al-Qa'eda, rather the immense hatred for them (as they are still Muslims), and the Jihad in general. Also, your hatred for those who rightly show baraa' against the kufaar shows your nifaaq, i.e. your baraa' or the lack of it.

Also, your claim of 'neo-khariji' is laughable at best. I'll talk to you of it another time, inshaAllah.

[Salahadeen]

Even 9/11 had a positive impact on the rate of conversions. So yeah, Hidayah comes from Allah, 'Azza wa Jal, alone.

OK I get it. So basically you can do anything stupid that will draw attention to Islam...Gotchya!

So why not go on a looting spree, running around the streets naked? That way the Kufaar will say 'hey, omg I am so taken out of my comfort zone that I should really research Islam!' Subhan-Allah, the naked looters harken in a new golden age of dawah!

You are a genius! Do something stupid, and then people will say 'wow that's pretty stupid' and then they might study Islam! Genius strategy!

Carry on! You guys seem to have it all under control.

[Salahadeen]

As for nifaaq, then the word I should have used was 'loaded with nifaaq' but to say 'filled' may be misconstrued as having nothing but nifaaq. So you have nifaaq, and as for your ignorance on this matter, then the Munafiq is to be exposed, since the revelation is complete, Alhamdulillah. But what shows your total ignorance is that nifaaq does not equal Munafiq. Just as shirk asghar and ar-riya do not equal Mushrik. So please, do your homework before you speak brother.


Before you lecture people about doing their homework, how about you not vomit out whatever comes out of your mouth? YOU are the one who typed what you wanted in the wrong manner, so this is YOUR fault, not mine. And no, you are wrong about this revelation being complete or not complete thing. Before his death, the Prophet [s] handed down the list of the munaafiqoon to one sahabi and that sahabi never revealed that list to anyone.

[AbiSalahuddin]

Before you lecture people about doing their homework, how about you not vomit out whatever comes out of your mouth? YOU are the one who typed what you wanted in the wrong manner, so this is YOUR fault, not mine. And no, you are wrong about this revelation being complete or not complete thing. Before his death, the Prophet [s] handed down the list of the munaafiqoon to one sahabi and that sahabi never revealed that list to anyone.

I admitted a typing error. I said my heart did not intend such. A Muslim would be excused from takfeer in this scenario:

“Verily, Allah is more pleased with the repentance of His slave than a person who rides the camel in a waterless desert and there is upon (the camel) his provision of food and drink also, and it is lost and he, having lost all hope (to get that back), lies down in shade and is disappointed about his camel; and all of a sudden he finds that camel standing before him. He takes hold of its rope and then out of boundless joy says: ‘Oh Lord, you are my slave and I am your lord!’ He commits this mistake out of extreme joy.” (Saheeh Muslim, Kitaab ut-Tawbah, Ch 1, H no. 2747)

As for the Munafiq thing, then if your contention is such that Munafiqoon should not be exposed, then I can assure you, this is getting waaay past ridiculous now. You really ought to start learning your Deen from good sources (if you don't do so already that is). Also, you did not respond to the other half or so of my post.

[Abu wakee]

ITS are the American version of pot-bellied goat lovers. This is about the only thing they are good at, trying their best to develop throat cancer.

[AbiSalahuddin]

ITS are the American version of pot-bellied goat lovers. This is about the only thing they are good at, trying their best to develop throat cancer.
You have lied.

[Brother_Mujahid]

ITS are the American version of pot-bellied goat lovers. This is about the only thing they are good at, trying their best to develop throat cancer.

I just so happen to personally know some of the brothers associated with the Islamic Thinkers Society, and even if we differ on some issues, they are very good brothers and loyal friends. I find your hateful and condescending attack offensive and ignorant. Does it make you feel good about yourself to spit on brothers you don't even know the first thing about?

[Hamza]

Nobody is saying that you have to say "islam is peace"...you could use a poster with a sword and kalimah, with a saying of Salahadeen or saying something like 'God will send us another Salahadeen'....or some powerful image like that, which would show Islam as a strong religion, and Muslims as a people willing to defend their kind. But to use a racist picture, do you think this has any benefit?

Again, answer honestly.

Good idea, you should email the brothers and maybe with a softer approach they would be open to this?

<table class="tborder" style="border-top-width: 0px;" align="center" border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr title="Post 112533" valign="top"><td class="alt2">Does it make you feel good about yourself to spit on brothers you don't even know the first thing about?</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="thead" colspan="2">
</td></tr></tbody></table>

lol, yea it makes him feel a million dollars. Misery loves company.

[Abu wakee]

I just so happen to personally know some of the brothers associated with the Islamic Thinkers Society, and even if we differ on some issues, they are very good brothers and loyal friends. I find your hateful and condescending attack offensive and ignorant. Does it make you feel good about yourself to spit on brothers you don't even know the first thing about?

I never said anything about their being good or bad, or did I?

You see i'm only taking what they say upon dhahir as you guys love doing that. Gathering from the takfir they make of entire saudi clergy, and post articles by mr. goat on their website, that's about the only conclusion I can make.

If you can't logically follow through what I'm saying that's not my problem.

Ciao.

[Brother_Mujahid]

Who are "you guys"?

Second, the brothers from Islamic Thinkers Society don't make mass takfir of the Saudi ulema. Surely they say some ridiculous and ignorant statements about "scholars of batil," but that isn't takfir and I had this discussion\debate with one of the leading members so I know where they stand on that issue. As for the 'Umar Bakri issue, these brothers are in the US and know little about him, so they just see some clips of Bakri being vocal and read some articles he wrote (especially on demonstrations) and thus repost them. I'm not going to defend that, but it isn't done out of malice.

Like I said, the way you come across causes me to think that you are trashing these brothers just to make yourself feel superior.

[Abu wakee]

It's like tit for tat right?

Thanks for the moral judgement.

[abumuwahid]

I've seen that section "Scholar's to be avoided/Scholar's of Baatil" on their site and they do not make takfeer of these scholars, so to say otherwise is misrepresentation of the facts.

I don't think these brothers have any link to OBM. I heard that they used to in the past, but have since moved on, like other of OBM's followers.

I agree with Brother Mujahid's stance on this issue, much more balanced Alhamdulillah.

Abu wakee is completely wrong.

[Salahadeen]

There is a joke about ITS, which is that if you want a listing of every Islamic scholar on earth, then just look at their list entitled 'scholars of batil'. It's got the whole roster.

[Abuz Zubair]

I don't think these brothers have any link to OBM. I heard that they used to in the past, but have since moved on, like other of OBM's followers.

They still remain Bakri followers, like you.

[islamic@rebel]

Geeks, Nerds, Dweebs and Semi-Men living in Pakistan shouldnt criticize NYC cab drivers.

[Abu Maysara]

Geeks, Nerds, Dweebs and Semi-Men living in Pakistan shouldnt criticize NYC cab drivers.
that was a funny comment, for a change.
but i thought that most of the pakis on this forum were living in the UK?

[islamic@rebel]

Glad you appreciated it brother. But it wasn't directed towards pakistanis, rather a certain hateful person who claims to live in Pakistan (and those like him).

[I_Am_A_Hermit]

Glad you appreciated it brother. But it wasn't directed towards pakistanis, rather a certain hateful person who claims to live in Pakistan (and those like him).

?

[Abu wakee]

Glad you appreciated it brother. But it wasn't directed towards pakistanis, rather a certain hateful person who claims to live in Pakistan (and those like him).

Atleast he'll be making money, while many like you will be driving cabs while bemoaning your crappy lives which would push you further into your nihilistic myopia.

[Hamza]

Cabbies earn great money lol. What will he do with his money? No use in the grave. OH BTW, what does the "Love Me" signify under your user name?

[Nu7]

AS-Salaamu 'Alaykum

OK I get it. So basically you can do anything stupid that will draw attention to Islam...Gotchya!

Man you seriously need to stop coming to these silly conclusions. My point was that Allah Guides whom He Wills. You can not say that no one will be guided because of this particular event. Leave that up to Allah (SWT). Not to say that you are not free to disagree with the way these brothers present themselves.

Also, I agree with the brother who commented on your extreme hate for those you refer to as "jihadists" or "extremists".

In reality you are no different than those who you call "extremists". You're just as extreme as them, the only difference is that you're on the opposite side of the spectrum. All it took for you to put a label on me was one sentence. So I'm one of "them" now lol.

You really need to stop acting as if you're the "voice of reason", you're driven by emotions and not reason.. and in that regard you are no different than those who call you an agent or say that you are defeatist (which I don't think you are, by the way).

May Allah 'Azza wa Jal Guide us all.

[Noorah]

AS-Salaamu 'Alaykum



Man you seriously need to stop coming to these silly conclusions. My point was that Allah Guides whom He Wills. You can not say that no one will be guided because of this particular event. Leave that up to Allah (SWT). Not to say that you are not free to disagree with the way these brothers present themselves.
so there are no rules for how to invite others to Islam?

Invite to the Way of your Lord with wisdom and fair preaching, and argue with them in a way that is better. Truly, your Lord knows best who has gone astray from His Path, and He is the Best Aware of those who are guided.

16:125

[Brother_Mujahid]

Such demonstrations are not intended as a method to invite people to Islam. They are done to show allegiance to the Muslims of Palestine and hatred and animosity toward the Zionist criminals. Have we become so politically correct that we cannot even tell the Judeo-fascists that we hate them and their filthy ideology?

[Nu7]

As-Salaamu 'Alaykum, sister.

so there are no rules for how to invite others to Islam?

Invite to the Way of your Lord with wisdom and fair preaching, and argue with them in a way that is better. Truly, your Lord knows best who has gone astray from His Path, and He is the Best Aware of those who are guided.

16:125


Again, that is NOT even close to what I said.

First of all, I don't know much about these brothers or the demonstration apart from what I have seen and read, so I don't know whether their intention with this rally was to make Da'wah or whether it was to condemn the state of Israel and educate people on the crimes of this State (seems to be the latter though). So in this case, they werent even intending to do Da'wah.

What I was commenting on, was brother Salahadeen's post in which he suggested that people would not accept islam because of this demonstration. That they would somehow be turned off by the whole thing. Can you honestly say that there is no possibility of Allah Guiding people through this particular event?

Although I don't agree with the event of 9/11, it would be stupid to deny the fact that many people accepted Islam as a result of that particular event, although the intention of the perpetrators was definately not Da'wah.

[Noorah]

wa alikum salam wa rahmatullah

ok my mistake, sorry for that.

I personally dont view demonstrations as wrong so long as they are within limits of islam. But i have seen demonstrations by ITS and they have gone overboard.

[Basic Muslim]

This "Islamic Thinkers" organization is an extremely small organization that has made takfeer of virtually all Muslims in the US and are used as "useful idiots" on anti-Muslims sites such as Little Green Footballs to make it look as if all of American Muslims are maniacs calling for death, murder and mayhem.

[Brother_Mujahid]

This "Islamic Thinkers" organization is an extremely small organization that has made takfeer of virtually all Muslims in the US and are used as "useful idiots" on anti-Muslims sites such as Little Green Footballs to make it look as if all of American Muslims are maniacs calling for death, murder and mayhem.

Prove that they made takfir of "virtually all Muslims in the US." It is not befitting of a Muslim to spread lies and malicious rumors. Remember what is said of the one who narrates everything he\she hears.

[Basic Muslim]

Prove that they made takfir of "virtually all Muslims in the US."

I have seen their website and they make takfeer of all the major organizations as well as most of the major speakers in the US. Since the vast majority of Muslims in the US respect these organizations and speakers (and at the very least do not consider them to be kufaar) they would be included in this given their ideology that anyone that does not make takfeer of a kaafir is a kaafir.

Alhamdulillah no one takes these guys seriously

[Brother_Mujahid]

I have seen their website and they make takfeer of all the major organizations as well as most of the major speakers in the US. Since the vast majority of Muslims in the US respect these organizations and speakers (and at the very least do not consider them to be kufaar) they would be included in this given their ideology that anyone that does not make takfeer of a kaafir is a kaafir.

Show us where they made takfir.

[Basic Muslim]

Show us where they made takfir.

Their website has a list

[Salahadeen]

Such demonstrations are not intended as a method to invite people to Islam. They are done to show allegiance to the Muslims of Palestine and hatred and animosity toward the Zionist criminals. Have we become so politically correct that we cannot even tell the Judeo-fascists that we hate them and their filthy ideology?

"Invite to the Way of thy Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious: for thy Lord knoweth best, who have strayed from His Path, and who receive guidance." (Quran, 16:125)

[Yousef al Khattab]

Their website has a list

They did not make takfir, they warned against them and called them deviants. Please do your homework b4 you post.

[Noorah]

They may not make outright takfir but some of their things are without a doubt wrong.

theyve called some of those scholars munafiq.

they have sheikh fawzaan as a scholar of batil, one of the things making him a 'scholar of batil' being:

He and his daughter can be seen travelling back and forth from Saudi Arabia to England without any hassle from the authorities whatsoever.


in their images page, is it islamic manner to call scholars they dont like dogs? and since they dont have a picture of one, although they disrespect him, they put a dogs face as his face?

[Brother_Mujahid]

We all know that the Islamic Thinkers Society has belittled and insulted the ulema, no one contests that, nor will any person with a grain of knowledge defend such things. As I said, they (ITS) has many things for which they can and should be criticized. At the same time exaggerating and distorting their positions "they make takfir of all the scholars," or "they make takfir of almost all American Muslims," are patently false and unjust.

Now, the issue here had nothing to do with their alleged stance on the scholars, but this specific protest. We have some people attacking them for daring to insult and degrade the Zionist criminal gangs, and we have some brothers defending them for supporting the Palestinians and showing hatred toward the Zionist scum. Let us stick to that and not throw around red herrings (http://www.fallacyfiles.org/redherrf.html) and stick to the issue at hand.

[Salahadeen]

We have some people attacking them for daring to insult and degrade the Zionist criminal gangs, and we have some brothers defending them for supporting the Palestinians and showing hatred toward the Zionist scum. Let us stick to that and not throw around red herrings (http://www.fallacyfiles.org/redherrf.html) and stick to the issue at hand.

This is what is called a straw man argument. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man) You are overstating your opponent's position, because that is easier to refute. Nobody here attacked anyone for insulting/degrading the Zionist criminal gang. Rather, the argument was to do so in a more productive and effective manner, without resorting to racist and haram pictures.

[Mustafa al-Muhaajir]

(You are not the only one who can link to external sites to seem sophisticated.)... don't think you want to start with Brother_Mujahid lol.

[Salahadeen]

... don't think you want to start with Brother_Mujahid lol.

I've deleted that line. Please delete the quote in your post insha-Allah.

[Mustafa al-Muhaajir]

I've deleted that line. Please delete the quote in your post insha-Allah.Can I get a 'pretty please with a cherry on top' ?

[Brother_Mujahid]

Can I get a 'pretty please with a cherry on top' ?


He is something of an enigma. On one hand he goes on about education with some very Ikhwaniish sounding rhetoric, yet becomes anti-intellectual when speaking with me. I feel like Obama being attacked by Hillary for being an elitist. :p

By the way, I composed a straw man deliberately because I felt I couldn't leave this thread without proving Jaysh an opportunity to show his intellectualism, while bashing me for being intellectual and sophisticated.

[Mustafa al-Muhaajir]

Jaysh, I just noticed your new signature.
Seems like we're rubbing off on you.

[Salahadeen]

Jaysh, I just noticed your new signature.
Seems like we're rubbing off on you.

I certainly hope not.

[Salahadeen]

He is something of an enigma. On one hand he goes on about education with some very Ikhwaniish sounding rhetoric, yet becomes anti-intellectual when speaking with me. I feel like Obama being attacked by Hillary for being an elitist. :p

By the way, I composed a straw man deliberately because I felt I couldn't leave this thread without proving Jaysh an opportunity to show his intellectualism, while bashing me for being intellectual and sophisticated.

Actually, I am henceforth following a policy of détente towards you, bro Mujahid. And that is why I deleted that last sentence. :)

As for the 'ikhwan', what is wrong with them?

[Mustafa al-Muhaajir]

I certainly hope not.http://www.upload2world.com/pic90/upload2world_c4b80.jpg (http://www.upload2world.com)

[Salahadeen]

lol nice pic.......

[Hamza]

Can I get a 'pretty please with a cherry on top' ?


:D

Jaysh, I just noticed your new signature.
Seems like we're rubbing off on you.and Maash'Allah, awesome signature. It cant however be translated as "hey i aint no pansy".

(Jaysh it's a joke, dont go doolally)

[Um Ismail]

hilarious.

[Brother_Mujahid]

Come on Jaysh, it is all good fun. No need to show me up with Cold War foreign policy references. :p