Prominent non-Salafis in the KSA?

[KnowledgeSeeker]

As salaamu alaykum.

Are there any da'ees in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia who enjoy a following among the masses who are quite clearly not "Salafi", be it in aqeedah or fiqh?

If such individuals exist, where does their deviance from Salafiyyah occur?

Remember, I am not looking to revive a debate on Hakimiyyah or the Madkhalees, but wondering if there are any prominent non-Salafis in the Kingdom who have either a following among the masses or who occupy key judicial or academic posts.

I think that this is important to know because many people have a mentality of "if its from Saudi Arabia, it has to be good".

Share what you know everyone.

Barakallahu Fee.

Wa'salaam.

[Abu Ma'mar]

What do you mean by not Salafi in fiqh?

What is salafi in fiqh?

[greenshirt]

Shaykh Muhammad al-Awwama, Habib Zayn, Abd al-Hafidh al-Makki, Sayyidi Alawi al-Maliki are major sufi scholars that live on the arabian peninsula. i got these names from sunnipath, which mentioned these scholars here (http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=7&ID=2700&CATE=164)

[Suhaib Jobst]

Wa Alaykum as-Salaam,

Basically I operate under the principle that beneficial knowledge shouldn't be shunned irregardless of who it comes from. We may have our disagreements here and there, sometimes even on certain matters of Creed. But when we really reflect on our predicament, we will surely realize there are far more commonalities than differences, masha'Allah. I would like to do my humble part to bridge the gap, insha'Allah.

Although I have certain disagreemens with them, I would recognize the scholarship of Shaykh Ibn Baz and Shaykh Ibn Uthaymin, rahimahumullah. I prefer to look at their good efforts and leave the rest of their affair to Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala).

However, the two recent scholars from al-Jazirat al-Arabiyya whom I would recommend were Shaykh Muhammad ibn Ibrahim and Shaykh Hamud ibn Uqla, rahimahumullah. Based on what I have read about them, these great scholars should be regarded as traditional Hanabila rather than theoretical Salafis. The former was indeed praised by the great scholars of the madhahib, the Shafi'i 'ulama of Shaam and Maliki 'ulama of Maghreb:

"Shaikh `Abdul Fattaah Abul Ghuddah was good friends with Shaikh Muhammad ibn Ibrahim and they used to write books together. They learned knowledge together. Shaikh Ghuddah bears witness to the mastery of the Shaikh in hadith as he was a teacher of his in the subject and he gave him an ijaaza, not in just learning it, but being a master, thus he was a muhaddith....

"Likewise, Shaikhs Habib and Shams ash-Shanqiti, two great scholars of hadith also bore witness to the MASTERY that this great Hanbali Faqih had. They were actually teachers who knew his level of mastery, then they said that he was a master, having learned from them what is necessary."

Another scholar often regarded as a Salafi, Shaykh Abdullah al-Mahmud (not sure if he is still alive?), was likewise more of an orthodox Hanbali, as demonstrated by his close friendship with and defense of such individuals as Shaykh Dr. Abdalqadir al-Murabit (hafidahullah). Unfortunately, the shaykh has not been given the recognition he should have and is not as well-known as some others in the Jazirat.

I really admire the wise and balanced approach of Shaykh Salman al-Awdah and Shaykh Safar al-Hawali, hafidahumullah. In my humble opinion, they have raised the level of scholarship to a respectable status with their admirable method. This is likewise true of the two members of Lajna ad-Da'ima who have nonetheless held themselves above the dominant fray, namely Shaykh Abdullah ibn Jibrin (hafidahullah) and Shaykh Bakr Abu Zaid (rahimahullah).

Shaykh Muhammad al-Awwama, Habib Zayn, Abd al-Hafidh al-Makki, Sayyidi Alawi al-Maliki are major sufi scholars that live on the arabian peninsula.

I know of nothing bad about the first three scholars, but the fourth promoted acts of Shirk and should be avoided for that reason. In fact, Said Ramadan Buti and Shaykh Abdullah al-Ghumari both made takfir (a weighty opinion not to be taken lightly) of Sayyid Muhammad al-Alawi "al-Maliki" due to these expressions of Shirk. Wa Allahu A'lam.

[aboo ahmad]

Was Sh. Abdullah bin Bayyah mentioned?

[Abdullah Ali al Hanafi]

Wa Alaykum as-Salaam,

Basically I operate under the principle that beneficial knowledge shouldn't be shunned irregardless of who it comes from. We may have our disagreements here and there, sometimes even on certain matters of Creed. But when we really reflect on our predicament, we will surely realize there are far more commonalities than differences, masha'Allah. I would like to do my humble part to bridge the gap, insha'Allah.

Although I have certain disagreemens with them, I would recognize the scholarship of Shaykh Ibn Baz and Shaykh Ibn Uthaymin, rahimahumullah. I prefer to look at their good efforts and leave the rest of their affair to Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala).

However, the two recent scholars from al-Jazirat al-Arabiyya whom I would recommend were Shaykh Muhammad ibn Ibrahim and Shaykh Hamud ibn Uqla, rahimahumullah. Based on what I have read about them, these great scholars should be regarded as traditional Hanabila rather than theoretical Salafis. The former was indeed praised by the great scholars of the madhahib, the Shafi'i 'ulama of Shaam and Maliki 'ulama of Maghreb:

"Shaikh `Abdul Fattaah Abul Ghuddah was good friends with Shaikh Muhammad ibn Ibrahim and they used to write books together. They learned knowledge together. Shaikh Ghuddah bears witness to the mastery of the Shaikh in hadith as he was a teacher of his in the subject and he gave him an ijaaza, not in just learning it, but being a master, thus he was a muhaddith....

"Likewise, Shaikhs Habib and Shams ash-Shanqiti, two great scholars of hadith also bore witness to the MASTERY that this great Hanbali Faqih had. They were actually teachers who knew his level of mastery, then they said that he was a master, having learned from them what is necessary."

Another scholar often regarded as a Salafi, Shaykh Abdullah al-Mahmud (not sure if he is still alive?), was likewise more of an orthodox Hanbali, as demonstrated by his close friendship with and defense of such individuals as Shaykh Dr. Abdalqadir al-Murabit (hafidahullah). Unfortunately, the shaykh has not been given the recognition he should have and is not as well-known as some others in the Jazirat.

I really admire the wise and balanced approach of Shaykh Salman al-Awdah and Shaykh Safar al-Hawali, hafidahumullah. In my humble opinion, they have raised the level of scholarship to a respectable status with their admirable method. This is likewise true of the two members of Lajna ad-Da'ima who have nonetheless held themselves above the dominant fray, namely Shaykh Abdullah ibn Jibrin (hafidahullah) and Shaykh Bakr Abu Zaid (rahimahullah).



I know of nothing bad about the first three scholars, but the fourth promoted acts of Shirk and should be avoided for that reason. In fact, Said Ramadan Buti and Shaykh Abdullah al-Ghumari both made takfir (a weighty opinion not to be taken lightly) of Sayyid Muhammad al-Alawi "al-Maliki" due to these expressions of Shirk. Wa Allahu A'lam.

al maliki died a long time ago right?

[Suhaib Jobst]

Was Sh. Abdullah bin Bayyah mentioned?

How could I have forgotten! May Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala) forgive me for forgetting about this great scholar. I guess I was thinking more in terms of those native to the Jazirat and forgot about this scholar from Mauritania, jazakallah khair. In this regard, I would also mention Shaykh Abu Bakr al-Jaza'iri (rahimahullah).

al maliki died a long time ago right?

On 15th Ramadan 1425, which corresponds to 29th October 2004.

As it concerns Shaykh Ibn Baz and Shaykh Ibn Uthaymin (rahimahumullah), it is too often forgotten that their approach in dealing with non-Salafis was balanced, since they recognized that there is no bond loftier than Islam.

This includes their praise of the scholars of Deoband and Jamaat-e-Tabligh. Their love for the Muslims led them to support the Jihad wherever the Islamic lands needed defending, as was evident in their close relationship with Shaykh Abdullah Azzam Shaheed (rahimahullah), whose efforts to unite the Muslims behind the Jihad manifested in the fact that he was a Mujahid, an activist of the Ikhwan who opposed the modernist compromises of its leadership, and likewise an orthodox Shafi'i scholar of Fiqh. Wa Allahu A'lam.

[Abu wakee]

I know of nothing bad about the first three scholars, but the fourth promoted acts of Shirk and should be avoided for that reason. In fact, Said Ramadan Buti and Shaykh Abdullah al-Ghumari both made takfir (a weighty opinion not to be taken lightly) of Sayyid Muhammad al-Alawi "al-Maliki" due to these expressions of Shirk. Wa Allahu A'lam.


Can you please provide exact statements with reference? Jzak Allah.

[aboo ahmad]

How could I have forgotten! May Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala) forgive me for forgetting about this great scholar. I guess I was thinking more in terms of those native to the Jazirat and forgot about this scholar from Mauritania, jazakallah khair. In this regard, I would also mention Shaykh Abu Bakr al-Jaza'iri (rahimahullah).



On 15th Ramadan 1425, which corresponds to 29th October 2004.

As it concerns Shaykh Ibn Baz and Shaykh Ibn Uthaymin (rahimahumullah), it is too often forgotten that their approach in dealing with non-Salafis was balanced, since they recognized that there is no bond loftier than Islam.

This includes their praise of the scholars of Deoband and Jamaat-e-Tabligh. Their love for the Muslims led them to support the Jihad wherever the Islamic lands needed defending, as was evident in their close relationship with Shaykh Abdullah Azzam Shaheed (rahimahullah), whose efforts to unite the Muslims behind the Jihad manifested in the fact that he was a Mujahid, an activist of the Ikhwan who opposed the modernist compromises of its leadership, and likewise an orthodox Shafi'i scholar of Fiqh. Wa Allahu A'lam.Jazaakumullaahu khayran katheera akh kareem

[aboo ayaat al hindee]

salafi in fiqh = no madhab?

[Abdullah Ali al Hanafi]

salafi in fiqh = no madhab?

mostly hanbali orientated but very anarchistic when it comes to madhhabs and rulings within a certain madhhab

[Magoo]

mostly hanbali orientated but very anarchistic when it comes to madhhabs and rulings within a certain madhhab

how are they arnachistic of all things?

[Abdullah Ali al Hanafi]

how are they arnachistic of all things?

their attitude is clear they think they know it better then the 4 imams and their students.

[KnowledgeSeeker]

their attitude is clear they think they know it better then the 4 imams and their students.

Please let us not make the thread deviate from its stated purpose.

[Suhaib Jobst]

I know of nothing bad about the first three scholars, but the fourth promoted acts of Shirk and should be avoided for that reason. In fact, Said Ramadan Buti and Shaykh Abdullah al-Ghumari both made takfir (a weighty opinion not to be taken lightly) of Sayyid Muhammad al-Alawi "al-Maliki" due to these expressions of Shirk. Wa Allahu A'lam.

First, my apologies for reviving an old thread but I wanted to undue some potential damage caused by the above statement. This was based on an allegation I read elsewhere, which has since been proven as false. I also regret that I was fooled by the Salafi attacks upon Sayyid Muhammad al-Alawi (rahimahullah), but the matter has become clear to me now, masha'Allah.

In reality, the Moroccan muhaddith Shaykh Abdullah al-Ghumari (rahimahullah) actually praised the works of the Shaykh and there is likewise no indication that the Syrian scholar Muhammad Sa'id Ramadan al-Buti made any attack upon him. This was an unverified allegation mentioned elsewhere, without any evidence.

So the Salafis mean by their attack upon the Shaykh, whom they have the gall to call a "mushrik", nothing other than a condemnation of Tawassul. And know that even those scholars who disavowed Tawassul, notably Ibn Taymiyya, nonetheless refrained from calling it "shirk".

What the Shaykh called for, as do all the practitioners of Tawassul, is to pray TO Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala) for the Intercession of the Prophet Muhammad (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam). The sole source of worship is Allah (Azza wa Jall), so I don't know why the Shaykh has been slandered in this manner. I pray to Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala) that even those brethren who disappraise Tawassul will adopt an honorable stance such as that undertaken by another brother:

"About Shaykh Alawi Al-Makki (rahimahullah), I don't agree with his position on tawassul. That however does not negate the fact that he had much knowledge."

http://riyada.blogspot.com/2006/09/glimpses-into-early-wahhabi-thought.html#c3463245947237388259


Finally, my mention of some leading contemporary figures of the Salafis is to be taken as an indication of their balanced approach in many issues. Rather, I disagree with them very strongly on many issues. However, there is some evidence that other figures mentioned (such as Shaykh Muhammad ibn Ibrahim) had far more in common with the traditional Hanabila than the modern Salafi movement. Wa Allahu A'lam.

[suhail]

Brother Suhaib

Please spare us with ur sufi garbage that you spout now regularly as you have found a new found religion. All the things salafi is bad and everything with sufis are good. We understand so please spare us the lecture.

[junaid123]

salafi in fiqh = no madhab?

have seen very few people who practise except the fiqh books ibn taymiah(rh),sheikh albani and bin baaz(rh).

[Navaid Aziz]

First, my apologies for reviving an old thread but I wanted to undue some potential damage caused by the above statement. This was based on an allegation I read elsewhere, which has since been proven as false. I also regret that I was fooled by the Salafi attacks upon Sayyid Muhammad al-Alawi (rahimahullah), but the matter has become clear to me now, masha'Allah.

In reality, the Moroccan muhaddith Shaykh Abdullah al-Ghumari (rahimahullah) actually praised the works of the Shaykh and there is likewise no indication that the Syrian scholar Muhammad Sa'id Ramadan al-Buti made any attack upon him. This was an unverified allegation mentioned elsewhere, without any evidence.

So the Salafis mean by their attack upon the Shaykh, whom they have the gall to call a "mushrik", nothing other than a condemnation of Tawassul. And know that even those scholars who disavowed Tawassul, notably Ibn Taymiyya, nonetheless refrained from calling it "shirk".

What the Shaykh called for, as do all the practitioners of Tawassul, is to pray TO Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala) for the Intercession of the Prophet Muhammad (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam). The sole source of worship is Allah (Azza wa Jall), so I don't know why the Shaykh has been slandered in this manner. I pray to Allah (Subhanahu wa Ta'ala) that even those brethren who disappraise Tawassul will adopt an honorable stance such as that undertaken by another brother:

"About Shaykh Alawi Al-Makki (rahimahullah), I don't agree with his position on tawassul. That however does not negate the fact that he had much knowledge."

http://riyada.blogspot.com/2006/09/glimpses-into-early-wahhabi-thought.html#c3463245947237388259


Finally, my mention of some leading contemporary figures of the Salafis is to be taken as an indication of their balanced approach in many issues. Rather, I disagree with them very strongly on many issues. However, there is some evidence that other figures mentioned (such as Shaykh Muhammad ibn Ibrahim) had far more in common with the traditional Hanabila than the modern Salafi movement. Wa Allahu A'lam.

I would love to hear your thoughts on this book Suhaib (please see attachment). It has referenced quotes from 'Alawi al-maliki.

Likewise, are you planning on finishing other threads you've participated in as well?

Just as a reminder Suhaib, never cease asking for guidance and firmness upon the truth.

I pray Allah guides us to that which is most beloved to him and grants us steadfastness upon it. Aameen.

Waffaqa Allahul jamee' li kulli khair.
Was salaam 'alaikum wa rahamatullah

[abu hafs]

I would love to hear your thoughts on this book Suhaib (please see attachment). It has referenced quotes from 'Alawi al-maliki.

Likewise, are you planning on finishing other threads you've participated in as well?

Just as a reminder Suhaib, never cease asking for guidance and firmness upon the truth.

I pray Allah guides us to that which is most beloved to him and grants us steadfastness upon it. Aameen.

Waffaqa Allahul jamee' li kulli khair.
Was salaam 'alaikum wa rahamatullah

Suhaib does not read arabic.

[Abdullah ibn Adam]

Suhaib: A word of advice. And I am speaking from personal experience. Don't allow yourself to get carried away by these "al-Murabitun" characters and their "shaykh" Abdalqadir. It is easy for someone in your situation to be over-awed by some of his writings. Yes, their articles about riba and the gold dinar are spot-on and excellent, however they are phenomenally ignorant about nearly everything else in the religion. And their shaykh - you can see for yourself if you read his articles - is perhaps one of the most ignorant of them all.

I myself went through a somewhat similar experience to you, al-hamdulillah for guidance and saving me from deviation.