Speaking to the opposite gender on messengers - good or bad?

[Salsabil]

Assalamu aleykum,

I have no doubt that for non-practicing Muslims, its best not to speak on msn, or other messengers, with the opposite gender, and I know this from my experience in jahiliya. How about when both parties are practicing, and know the limits? There are different fatawa on islam-qa, and other sites on this topic, but what is your view and experiences? I myself had mixed experiences.

Barakallahu feek!

[Umm Ahmed]

Wa 'alaykumusalaam

Bad , That person will be added to your list ,and you will be talking everyday.

Amr ibn Rabiah (r.a.a) narrated that Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w) said, "Whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day must never be in private with a woman without there being a mahram of hers (a male relation to whom she cannot marry), otherwise Shaytan will be the third person with them." [Ahmad].

[Abuz Zubair]

Khalwa should be avoided, be it MSN or any other medium. Any sort of situation where there is no third person looking which gives people from the opposite gender the privacy the Shaytan loves should be avoided, especially if they are practising.

[Brother_Mujahid]

I would recommend this article:

http://www.islamicawakening.com/viewarticle.php?articleID=1160

[Salsabil]

Wa 'alaykumusalaam

Bad , That person will be added to your list ,and you will be talking everyday.

Amr ibn Rabiah (r.a.a) narrated that Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w) said, "Whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day must never be in private with a woman without there being a mahram of hers (a male relation to whom she cannot marry), otherwise Shaytan will be the third person with them." [Ahmad].

I understand the hadith, and try hard not to be alone with a non-mahram woman, even in the same car. However, speaking in a messenger, is not the same thing is it? Because there can not be anything other than speaking, however much shaytan or the two parties would strive for it. There can be attachment, and there could be feelings, but the practicing Muslims would just try to find legal ways to be together in this case. Otherwise, many Muslims live across the world and among kuffar, and have a difficulty in finding the right person to marry, and these messengers help people to find out more about each other. Wallahu Alam.

[Abu wakee]

Lol this reminds me how so many of these internet SJ kids had backdoor affairs and friendships on MSN messengers and so on. It's not even funny. They were all in it way too deep.

[Abu Bakr as-Somali]

I have no doubt that for non-practicing Muslims, its best not to speak on msn, or other messengers, with the opposite gender,

It wasnt? Did you grow up between the Amish or something lol.

[Abuz Zubair]

I understand the hadith, and try hard not to be alone with a non-mahram woman, even in the same car. However, speaking in a messenger, is not the same thing is it? Because there can not be anything other than speaking, however much shaytan or the two parties would strive for it. There can be attachment, and there could be feelings, but the practicing Muslims would just try to find legal ways to be together in this case. Otherwise, many Muslims live across the world and among kuffar, and have a difficulty in finding the right person to marry, and these messengers help people to find out more about each other. Wallahu Alam.
Speaking on MSN is not the same thing. It is much worse, because for some really weird reasons the feelings that are expressed in writing cannot be expressed vocally in a face-to-face meeting. People on MSN become more daring and less God-fearing. And it is even worse for practising people since it is precisely this crowd the Shaytan strives to lead astray. I won't say speaking on MSN should be outlawed altogether, but chatting between opposite sexes unnecessarily should be very strongly discouraged.

[Salsabil]

Lol this reminds me how so many of these internet SJ kids had backdoor affairs and friendships on MSN messengers and so on. It's not even funny. They were all in it way too deep.

they werent born SJ's, were they... life is such...

[AnonyMousey]

Bad. Very very very bad.

[Umm Ahmed]

I understand the hadith, and try hard not to be alone with a non-mahram woman, even in the same car. However, speaking in a messenger, is not the same thing is it? Because there can not be anything other than speaking, however much shaytan or the two parties would strive for it. There can be attachment, and there could be feelings, but the practicing Muslims would just try to find legal ways to be together in this case. Otherwise, many Muslims live across the world and among kuffar, and have a difficulty in finding the right person to marry, and these messengers help people to find out more about each other. Wallahu Alam.

Women and men have fallen in love through the written word for centuries .

Your saying that practicing muslims would find a legal way to be together. I would love to be a fly on the wall when the sister has to tell her father she met someone through the MSN .
Also what would you both do if her wali does not allow the marriage , what happens to the feelings then ?
Also what if you want to see how each other look ? this is why things that lead to Haram are not permissible in Islaam.

[Salsabil]

ok, the married people mostly say its bad, what about the unmarried ones?

[Salsabil]

Your saying that practicing muslims would find a legal way to be together. I would love to be a fly on the wall when the sister has to tell her father she met someone through the MSN.


I have met numerous sisters within the sharia (in public) after knowing them through the net. If the looks are satisfactory, after that I would find out more about the family and so on, and the same she would do. What difference does it make then, how they found out about each other initially?


Also what would you both do if her wali does not allow the marriage , what happens to the feelings then ?


This could happen with anyone, not only ones who used the MSN.


Also what if you want to see how each other look ?

Meet within the sharia guidelines. Wallahu Alam.

[leo]

Lol this reminds me how so many of these internet SJ kids had backdoor affairs and friendships on MSN messengers and so on.

In addition, there is a tendency of boys portraying as girls and vice versa.

[Turaabie]

In addition, there is a tendency of boys portraying as girls and vice versa.

Sad, sad people.

[Abu wakee]

In addition, there is a tendency of boys portraying as girls and vice versa.

Some of the girls even ran off with their SJ BFs and got married without the consent of the wali because they considered their parents Kafirs.

Such is the world of cyber psuedo-jeehawwdees.

[Mustafa al-Muhaajir]

Such is the world of cyber psuedo-jeehawwdees.Didn't know you read comic books ...

[Abu wakee]

Didn't know you read comic books ...

Well I like to have a laugh at characters like yourself, once in a while...

[Mustafa al-Muhaajir]

Well I like to have a laugh at characters like yourself, once in a while...Who said I'm an SJ ?
I'm a peace-loving moderate Muslim, I hug trees in my spare time.

[Abu wakee]

Who said I'm an SJ ?
I'm a peace-loving moderate Muslim, I hug trees in my spare time.



While you are at it, don't forget to kiss them.

[y-mughal]

It might possibly be the case some individuals (i.e. Abu wakee) have been rejected so many times for marriage that he's just jealous that others are happily married and in his rage exposing other Muslims alleged sins - which if true is a serious enough sin on your records for exposing others sins and if not is then even a bigger sin for slander.

[Abu wakee]

It might possibly be the case some individuals (i.e. Abu wakee) have been rejected so many times for marriage that he's just jealous that others are happily married and in his rage exposing other Muslims alleged sins - which if true is a serious enough sin on your records for exposing others sins and if not is then even a bigger sin for slander.

Did I name anyone, you knuckle head? Anyway your comment makes absolutely no sense in the context of what I think about you people when one looks at my posts as a whole. I only found it prudent to mention in order to firstly highlight the dangers of chatting one on one, and also the psychological problems people like your goodself have developed.

[Abuz Zubair]

Brothers, please resist. You don't have to respond to insults.

[Umm]

Your saying that practicing muslims would find a legal way to be together. I would love to be a fly on the wall when the sister has to tell her father she met someone through the MSN .



Abdul: we can have an online nikkah
I'm getting married *screams* http://www.maniacmuslim.com/images/flower.gif: a what?!
Abdul: yeah! it should be easy to do. i think everyone we need is online right now. let's get it done!
I'm getting married *screams* http://www.maniacmuslim.com/images/flower.gif: oh wow
Abdul: come on, i'm sinning right now just typing to you. let's nikkah this thing asap!
I'm getting married *screams* http://www.maniacmuslim.com/images/flower.gif: arright arright lemme call my abbu and tell him the story... that u r being stingy and don't want to book a banquet hall and just want to do it online http://www.maniacmuslim.com/images/wink.gif lolzz
Abdul: lol
I'm getting married *screams* http://www.maniacmuslim.com/images/flower.gif: brb
Abdul: k
I'm getting married *screams* http://www.maniacmuslim.com/images/flower.gif: omg my dad agrees haha

Online Nikah (maniac muslim) (http://www.maniacmuslim.com/Online_Nikkah.html)

[Abu_Talha]

salaam
can someone please tell me what SJ stands for? i'm not too savvy with internet talk.

just my opinion on the issue at hand: BAD! i think more evil comes from it than good, so I would avoid it. Though of course, Allah knows best.

['Abd al-Kareem]

Abuz Zubair made a very, very good point. In general, someone might find that he or she will say things in text that he or she would have been way too shy/embarassed to say face-to-face or even on the phone.

[Abu_Salamah]

Well I like to have a laugh at characters like yourself, once in a while...

I'm kinda new to the forum and already i know who the ignorant ones are.

[Adem Al-Albani]

Pretty retarted. The sister you are talking to, talks to like 10 other brothers, tellin him the same thing. "I love you akhee....fillah."

[Abu Dharr Al Kashmiri]

Did I name anyone, you knuckle head? Anyway your comment makes absolutely no sense in the context of what I think about you people when one looks at my posts as a whole. I only found it prudent to mention in order to firstly highlight the dangers of chatting one on one, and also the psychological problems people like your goodself have developed.

Fear Allah....Listen Mr Mota, if you insist on calling people silly names online, then you are pretty brave aren't you? You too need to get out of your comic world of blogs, and try and correct when you see a fellow brother who has done wrong.

Wassalaam

[Umm Ahmed]

I have met numerous sisters within the sharia (in public) after knowing them through the net. If the looks are satisfactory, after that I would find out more about the family and so on, and the same she would do. What difference does it make then, how they found out about each other initially?


Wow numerous sisters okay if you think it's okay to do that ,then there is not a lot we can add to that. Brother_Mujahids post says it all.

http://forums.islamicawakening.com/showpost.php?p=124906&postcount=4

[Scented Blood]

Would you allow your wife to do the same thing?

[Magoo]

unfortunately there are many cases of practising brothers and sisters falling in to zina because they chat to each other on mobile phones and msn under the pretence of "dawah", i dont see any difference between mobile phones and msn and both are very dangerous

as one brother said "if you want to email a sister, cc her dad in the email, otherwise dont bother"

Allah knows best

[Umm]

Husband: Btw darling, I forbid you to use msn

Wife: But that's how we met! Why is it haram now?

Husband: Coz we're married now, so you shouldn't be speaking to non-mahram brothers...

[I_Am_A_Hermit]

Husband: Btw darling, I forbid you to use msn

Wife: But that's how we met! Why is it haram now?

Husband: Coz we're married now, so you shouldn't be speaking to non-mahram brothers...

lol

This topic bought this to mind;

'If you have no shame, do what you want'.

Also..

''Allaah will keep firm those who believe, with the word that stands firm in this world and the Hereafter. And Allaah will cause to go astray those who are wrongdoers, and Allaah does what He wills''. (Surah Ibrahim, Verse 27)

[Salsabil]

Pretty retarted. The sister you are talking to, talks to like 10 other brothers, tellin him the same thing. "I love you akhee....fillah."

I think this is prohibited, and dont remember ever saying this openly.

[Salsabil]

Wow numerous sisters okay if you think it's okay to do that ,then there is not a lot we can add to that. Brother_Mujahids post says it all.

http://forums.islamicawakening.com/showpost.php?p=124906&postcount=4

I tend to agree with Abu Zubair about this, in general. However, there could be more fitna, if young Muslims dont get married on time, by any legal means, and sometimes, this is the only means to know someone well enough. Wallahu Alam.

[Salsabil]

unfortunately there are many cases of practising brothers and sisters falling in to zina because they chat to each other on mobile phones and msn under the pretence of "dawah",

I am very surprised to hear that. They werent so practising afterall, perhaps.

[Abu wakee]

Fear Allah....Listen Mr Mota, if you insist on calling people silly names online, then you are pretty brave aren't you? You too need to get out of your comic world of blogs, and try and correct when you see a fellow brother who has done wrong.

Wassalaam

Blogs eh? Lol, anyway you have a point, but then again I wasn't specifically correcting any wrong, but giving a general example. And you know it does happen.

[Umm Ahmed]

I am very surprised to hear that. They werent so practising afterall, perhaps.


The thing is practicing people are humans and not robots and are prone to sin just the same as anyone else , Shaytan will always keep at it , no matter how practicing you are.

From an-Nu'maan ibn Basheer (radiyAllâhu 'anhu) who said that I heard Allâh's Messenger (salAllâhu 'alaihi wa'sallam) say:

"That which is lawful is clear, and that which is forbidden is clear, and between them are doubtful matters about which many of the people have no knowledge. So whoever avoids doubtful matters saves his Religion and his honour, and whoever falls into doubtful matters falls into what is forbidden. Just like a shepherd who grazes (his sheep) near to a private pasture (of another), he will soon stray on to it. Indeed for every king there is a private preserve. Indeed the preserve of Allâh are those things which He has forbidden. Indeed there is a piece of flesh in the body which if it is good, then the whole body is good, but if it is corrupt then the whole body is corrupt. Indeed it is the heart

May Allaah protect you from falling into sin brother ameen.

[Salsabil]

Question: Two people fall in love after getting to know each other online. Will their marriage be a success or a failure?

Answered by Ghâdah bint Ahmad Hasan

It is Allah’s blessing to us that we have these technologies today that, if we use them properly, facilitate for us many ways of lawful communication and interaction.

The Internet, with its many features – like Messenger and online forums – has provided young Muslims, both men and women, with an easy way to get to know one another and exchange ideas. There is nothing wrong with this, as long as everything is done with the parents’ full knowledge and oversight. As long as our conversations are in conformity with the dictates and etiquettes of Islamic Law, then they remains upon the default ruling of being lawful.

The Qur’ân gives us the general ruling to be applied when men and women speak with each other: “Be not soft of speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease aspires (to you), but utter customary speech.” [Sûrah al-Ahzâb: 32]

This is evidence that speaking in and of itself is lawful between men and women. The Qur’ân does not provide us with guidelines for doing things that are unlawful!

Nevertheless, frequent conversation can lead young men and women to start liking each other. Their hearts can become attached. This is part of our human nature, which Allah has placed in us. It is in our makeup. It is naïve to think otherwise and a mistake for anyone to think that he or she is strong enough to resist it. No one is immune.

People differ only in two things: their degree of moral integrity that they exercise when faced with the situation, and the decisions that they make.

This brings us to what must be done when two Muslims find themselves falling in love online. They have two choices.

1. They can decide to stop all communication with one another once they realize that an emotional attachment has begun between them, and nip it in the bud.

2. They can start taking the practical and lawful steps with their families to realize their feelings in a lawful way.

In either case, this means that it is unlawful for them, Islamically, to develop a romantic relationship online. Once they are emotionally drawn to each other, they can no longer keep up their online acquaintance. Persisting in their online relationship will only cause their desire for each other to grow stronger until it overwhelms their ability to reason and make sound decisions. They could develop serious emotional ties even though they could never fulfill them in a lawful way, or through a happy marriage, due to the disparity in their social circumstances, their looks, or the possibility of their parents’ approval.

Therefore, once a man and woman on the Internet find that they are emotionally drawn to each other, they must do what is right and proper. The young man should make overtures to the woman’s family and seek from them permission to pursue marriage according to the proper custom. In this way, the future of their relationship will be determined according to the moral dictates of Islam.

There will be either acceptance from the family, in which case we have nothing but praise for the Internet that acted as a means for the wholesome and good Islamic marriage. Or the marriage proposal, after due consideration, will be turned down, while reason still reigns supreme.

Therefore, marriage that results from an initial contact online can be successful or unsuccessful. This depends on how the two people conduct themselves from the start. How they take matters after their interest in each other is kindled makes all the difference in the long run.

And Allah knows best.

http://www.islamtoday.net/english/show_detail_section.cfm?q_id=1189&main_cat_id=39

[umm_sabah]

if you're looking to marry, and are using it as a medium to get in contact with some potentials... i dnt see anything wrong, so long as a line isn't crossed.

but other than that... just to chat, have a laugh... etc i dont think thats permissible at all.

i think all replies are a case of [with everyone at some point] "been there, done that, from experience --- no"

[Islamiyyah]

Yea I agree with Umm Sabah, if its with the intention of like speaking to a potential spouse then I dont see the matter with it as well. Or even asking a brother general questions etc.