imaam nawawi and abu yazid as sufi

[Madarijas-Salikeen]

salamu alaykum

I was reading that Imaam nawawi rahimullah qouted from Abu yazid about basically tazkiyyah an nafs. and as we know abu yazid was alleged to be the original one to come up with the concept oneness with Allaah (though sufis say not in literal state) . What i find significant is that Imaam nawawi rahimullah qoutes from the likes of abu yazid who is praised and regarded as an ascetic. Not only this but imam nawawi also supporting Tasawwuf. Also Sulayman ibn abdul wahab stated in as saniya that his father (muhammad ibn abdul wahab) was not against tariqa as sufiya, but was rather against grave worship. So it seems like Sufism that is backed by quran and sunnah is acceptable in shariah standings.

Any comments? jazakallah khayr

[SAINT GEORGE OF ARABIA]

please forgive me if i use this word....

sufis are deviant muslims with gay mentality.... they would love to link any famous name with their filths.
i have also heard that ibn tayimiyyah didnt condemn tasawwuf, and also some other imams of ahl-us-sunnah.
you said that sufism may be acceptable according to quran and sunnah, do you have evidence? or are you playing the same game of enforcing bidaa on us.

[aburasheed]

There is already thread talking about this:
http://forums.islamicawakening.com/showthread.php?t=1921

[SAINT GEORGE OF ARABIA]

i dont waste my time discussing sufism
qiyam layl and fasting in the day is better than any other bidaa these people could come up with.
just read in the other thread that all hanbali scholars were sufis.

now you see the sufis similarity with gay people.

they want everybody to join them in their filths so they will link every ahl-us-sunnah scholar with it.
it also said there that the prophet(pbuh) used the word tasawwuf......utter rubbish!!!

[Um Abdullah M.]

Saint George of Arabia
please do not say such things as >> sufis are deviant muslims with gay mentality <<

it serves no purpose and it is not the way to answer people who ask u a question, especially one who is still learning.

also, not all sufis are deviant, some early sufis were on right path, but majority of todays' sufis are deviant, and our duty is to do dawah to them not curse, or use such language.

as for Abu Yazid al-Bastami, I read that him saying "subhani" and some other things were attributed to him falsely, and that there are quotes by him that showed that he practiced tasawwuf by Quran and Sunnah.
That is why Shaikh al-Islam Ibn Taimiyyah rahimahu Allah and other scholars did not accuse him of kufr and great devianct like to Ibn Arabi, Ibn Fard and others who believe in wuhdat alwujood.

wallahu a'lam.

So it seems like Sufism that is backed by quran and sunnah is acceptable in shariah standings.


yes, it is acceptable if it is according to Quran and Sunnah, but the parctice of majority of sufis today is not according to Quran and Sunnah.
many innovations are found in it, and they take the issue of bid'ah and sad adhrai' (blocking the means to haram) to easily, to point that so many of their laymen commit clear shirk, becasue many of their beliefs lead to such a thing.

[Um Abdullah M.]

i dont waste my time discussing sufism
qiyam layl and fasting in the day is better than any other bidaa these people could come up with.
just read in the other thread that all hanbali scholars were sufis.

now you see the sufis similarity with gay people.

they want everybody to join them in their filths so they will link every ahl-us-sunnah scholar with it.
it also said there that the prophet(pbuh) used the word tasawwuf......utter rubbish!!!

but brother, this brother is only asking, because he reads this stuff in sufi sites, so we should give him an answer.

but I do agree that it is totally ridiculous of them to make almost all scholars of past sufis including many hanbali shaikhs who were not sufi or following any sufi tariqa, and to say that one is sufi becaue he was given or wore a "sufi cloak" is total nonsense.
also, many scholars who praised sufis, were praising sufis who followed Quran and Sunnah, and u will find them in other places condemning the later sufis who worshiped Allah with innovations and deviances.

[Um Abdullah M.]

here is what I found in majmoo' fatawa Ibn Taimiyyah (Rahimahu Allah)

وَقَدْ جَمَعَ أَبُو الْفَضْلِ الْفَلَكِيُّ كِتَابًا مِنْ كَلَامِ أَبِي يَزِيدَ البسطامي سَمَّاهُ " النُّور مِنْ كَلَامِ طيفور " فِيهِ شَيْءٌ كَثِيرٌ لَا رَيْبَ أَنَّهُ كَذِبٌ عَلَى أَبِي يَزِيدَ البسطامي وَفِيهِ أَشْيَاءُ مِنْ غَلَطِ أَبِي يَزِيدَ - رَحْمَةُ اللَّهِ عَلَيْهِ - وَفِيهِ أَشْيَاءُ حَسَنَةٌ مِنْ كَلَامِ أَبِي يَزِيدَ وَكُلُّ أَحَدٍ مِنْ النَّاسِ يُؤْخَذُ مِنْ قَوْلِهِ وَيُتْرَكُ إلَّا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ .

also in siyar a'lam an-nubala' by Imam ad-Dhahabi rahimahu Allah

وله هكذا نكت مليحة، وجاء عنه أشياء مشكلة لا مساغ لها، الشأن في ثبوتها عنه، أو أنه قالها في حال الدهشة والسكر (2)، والغيبة والمحو، فيطوى، ولا يحتج بها (3)، إذ ظاهرها إلحاد، مثل: سبحاني، وما في الجبة إلا الله.

and he mentioned other sayings attributed to him.

[SAINT GEORGE OF ARABIA]

i like it when people say that not all sufis are bad....some are good
the early sufis were really vgood, what happened then
where did the early sufism go?
like i said..... i have no time for innovation
how can something borrowed from the greek be any good for islam?

[SAINT GEORGE OF ARABIA]

those early sufis hurt this ummah more because they are the forefathers of modern sufis. agreed with it or not
why were they sufi in the first place? what was wrong with sunnah then?
people seem to be lenient towards early sufis that they were good. its absolutely wrong.
it's safe for me to reject all of them.

[Abu_Abdillah2000]

al-Imam Muhammad ibn 'Abdil-Wahhab and his son ash-Shaykh 'Abdullah did not condemn tasawwuf as a whole, rather they condemned the innovations and deviancies that had crept into it and corrupted it.

Real tasawwuf is the same as what we call a combination of zuhd, tazkiyatun-nafs, wara', and perfecting the worship of Allah, inwardly and outwardly. But today, the term "tasawwuf" has become mixed up with and identified with a whole lot of bid'ah and dhalalah, as any honest person who has observed them will realise. So "tasawwuf" is just a word, it depends on how it is used and explained. Shaykhul-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah and his pupil Ibnul-Qayyim and many other scholars of the past have many times spoken highly in praise of tasawwuf, and they have also criticised it and condemned it. What people need to understand is that when these scholars praised tasawwuf, what they meant was in the sense of zuhd, wara', ibadah, tazkiyatun-nafs, dhikr etc. And when they criticised it, they meant the bid'ahs and misguidances that many of the claimants to zuhd and tazkiyatun-nafs had brought.

So I advise every one of my brothers and sisters to be in a middle path with regard to the term "tasawwuf" and its definition, otherwise you will get confused, and you might also confuse others. Many of today's mubtadi'ah "sufis" read some of Ibn Taymiyyah's words in praise of tasawwuf, and misunderstand them to mean that Ibn Taymiyyah was a sufi mubtadi' like them. And many less-informed salafis read Ibn Taymiyyah's words condemning tasawwuf, and they reject anything at all remotely to do with tasawwuf, thereby "throwing the baby out with the bathwater", as they say.

To conclude, let no-one be misled by today's so-called "sufi tariqahs", as they are for the most part highly unrepresentative of the tasawwuf/zuhd/'ibadah/dhikr/tazkiyatun-nafs of the Salaf, as anyone who is familiar with the athar of the Salaf and the reality of these so-called tariqahs will know. I had, in the past, a good opinion of some of these tariqahs until I saw them close-up and realised how much jahl, bid'ah and ta'assub that they have, which is all completely opposed to the authentic Sunnah of Rasulullah, sallallahu 'alayhi wa-sallam.

[Abu_Abdillah2000]

those early sufis hurt this ummah more because they are the forefathers of modern sufis. agreed with it or not
why were they sufi in the first place? what was wrong with sunnah then?
people seem to be lenient towards early sufis that they were good. its absolutely wrong.
it's safe for me to reject all of them.

This is an invalid argument, and it is unfair to blame the early Sunni mutasawwifah for the errors of those who came centuries after them. By the same reasoning, the four Imams and the great muhaddithun should be blamed, because in the centuries after them came many fake claimants to knowledge of fiqh and hadith, evil and corrupt scholars who spread bid'ah, defended it, and engaged in fanaticism of their madhhabs, or who fabricated false ahadith, all in the name of following the four imams and defending their madhahib.

Do you see my point?

[SAINT GEORGE OF ARABIA]

it's a valid point if you look at the big picture, it's wrong to say that some sufis are good if we keep saying that we will never prosper.
we are harsh on shia but when it comes to sufis we start making excuses about them. this is the greatest mistake and if we dont correct it this ummah will still be in the same position. we just concentrate on spiritual sufi whom i find harmless, the most dangerous ones are political sufis who control every governments on earth apart from may be 3 countries. shia only control persia but the rest of the world is ruled islamically by sufis, in a muslim country or not. they have the power it's worse in a non islamic country because the kafir ruler trust them more than you. they will decide who and where you should build a mosque or school, what you should preach or teach there.
and everytime you try to rise up the kafir will use them to put you down, that's the case in chechenya and most recently in somalia.
how are we going to rule anywhere if we keep ignoring sufi plots against this ummah.and they dangerously disguise as sunni to seduce anyone but oppress the real ahul sunnah wa jamaa. you tell me which country in the world with a mufti from the ahl-us-sunnah wa jamaa? even saudi arabia is dodgy cause i doubt the aqeeda of the saudi salafis. surely if we scrutinise their leaders we will find some sufi signs in them...ie tempering with beards and long clothes but the saudi salafi pledge allegiance to them....w'Allahu musta'an.
and those leaders dont trust you, they trust a sufi more. when they pay millions to poor countries to build mosques and schools they will give it to islamic authorities and those are sufis, they will just fill their pockets and even share it with kafir leaders from poor countries. congo, angola or vietnam etc.... where muslims are minorities, sufis control everything and link well with government officials while ahl-us-sunnah are second class.and next year, the saudi, kuweiti government or any rich country will give the money to the same people. in congo there is only one masjid of ahl-us-sunnah and doesnt have roof. no prayer if it rains but look at government controlled masjid..... very beautiful.
in the west, who's being used to fight the so-called extremism and implement moderation...sufis, kabbani and hamza yussuf are sufis.
recently in uk, the government invinted a group called radical midway to teach young muslim islam. and they are getting big....they are sufi.
we are wasting time here discussing tasawwuf which wouldnt harm anyone, but we are ignoring the political sufi who sells out everytime for the love of dunya. if he still walking around freely, the kafir will always find a way to undermine the efforts we are making to raise this deen.

ALL SUFIS ARE DANGEROUS, IF YOU DONT BELIEVE IT MAY ALLAH CURE YOUR BLINDNESS BECAUSE THEY ARE AMONG US AND CAN CLAIM TO BE SUNNI WHEN THEY FEEL LIKE AND DESTROY THIS DEEN AS ALWAYS

barakallahu feek

[SAINT GEORGE OF ARABIA]

few years ago, a worse massacre happened in tanzania and didnt make news.
who's the mufti of tanzania? a sufi
he declared the victims enemies of state. the presiden in malawi is a sufi, he gets money from rich arabs and doesnt build anything.
i dont know about the mufty of china but i can only guess
you shouldn't just focus on tassawuf, sufis love for dunya is harming muslims more than the kafir.

[Abdullah al-Shishani]

Here is one claimant to and defender of sufism Ramzan Kadirov, doing "zikr":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7t1JGASwbQ

And he calls mujahedeen - shaitans! He says that he will fight them, whom he calls wahhabies, to his last breath. Insha Allah it will be soon.

More pictures of the sufi shaykh:

http://www.amina.com/gfx/data/545/mike-ramzik-ic.jpg

http://www.amina.com/gfx/data/545/krestonos.jpg

[edited... be careful of what you post matey! To other mods, I fell off my chair seeing that! wakey, wakey!]

[edited for the same reason AZ]

[Abu Dharr Al Kashmiri]

http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=4983&ln=eng&txt=amulets

[Madarijas-Salikeen]

jazakallah khayr abu abdullah

[Abu_Abdillah2000]

Brother Abdullah ash-Shishani, please edit out the pictures with the naked whores in them, this is an Islamic forum. I agree that Ramadan Kafirov is a big munafiq murtadd, but still please do something about those pictures so that they do not cause a fitnah for the brothers, barakallahu feek.

[Abdullah al-Shishani]

I agree that Ramadan Kafirov is a big munafiq murtadd, but still please do something about those pictures so that they do not cause a fitnah for the brothers, barakallahu feek.

Wa iyyak akhee, but now I will think twice about calling him a munafiq or murtad, afterrall he claims that what he is doing, he is doing it for the well being of his people, and if you listen to what he says in Chechen, he doesnt say the russians are good, he says the wahhabies are bad, and being with russia is good in terms of dunya for us. And according to the beloved scholars who dont get tired of praising the throne, this is enough for him to be just a sinner. Moreover, the throne itself has good relationship with Ramzan and had with his father (great puzzle or rather could make sense) and since we know how the saudi regime is being praised, then we wouldnt want to go against the ulama, would we?

I always knew how weak the sufi scholars (many) were in Chechnya, and how much they loved dunya, and those who have it. Perhaps I was naive to think that it is so only with sufi scholars.

[Abu_Abdillah2000]

Jazakallahu khayran brother Abuz-Zubayr for editing out the pictures.

Brother Abdullah ash-Shishani: Not that I have any love for Ramadan Kadirov, but still perhaps I should have been more careful calling him a murtadd until I know his situation clearly, wallahu a'lam. I think it was just a knee-jerk reaction by me dating back to the time when I was less careful about such matters. Anyway at the very least, even if he is not a murtadd, he is still obviously a fasiq and a traitor and a mubtadi' as well. May Allah give him what he deserves, and protect the Muslims from his evil.

[Abdullah al-Shishani]

By the way, I did think before posting these pictures, but then I thought that exposing him is important, afterall we probably would want to see the evidence if someone were to claim that King Abdullah did something similar. I guess I was mistaken.

[Abu_Abdillah2000]

I can't help but notice a tone of sarcasm in your posts, brother Abdullah ash-Shishani... correct me if I'm wrong...

BTW just because a person refrains from making takfir of the Saudi rulers does not mean that he is defending every single thing that they do, nor that he considers them to be the best examples of pious Muslims.

[Abdullah al-Shishani]

I can't help but notice a tone of sarcasm in your posts, brother Abdullah ash-Shishani... correct me if I'm wrong...

BTW just because a person refrains from making takfir of the Saudi rulers does not mean that he is defending every single thing that they do, nor that he considers them to be the best examples of pious Muslims.


No brother, I am not being sarcastic, I was actually saddened by these inconsistencies on the part of scholars, and perhaps was speaking with emotions, I am not saying anything against you or accussing or something. Insha Allah I consider this confusion, as a trial from Allah, and ask Him to guide me to the Haq and make me accept it, even if its against my fitra or hawa.

[Abu_Abdillah2000]

Brother Abdullah ash-Shishani: Please forgive me, I misunderstood the intent of your statements.