Abu Aaliyah

[abu_ibrahim]

Can someone tell me whats the score with this bloke called Abu Aaliyah?

His quoting Shaykh Uthaymeen and also links his website to Hamza Yusuf's site. His been teaching Hanbali fiqh classes weekly.

He also had Burdah released on audio, some bro told me that the dodgy lyrics were removed. Don't know about that.

[Abuz Zubair]

Well, he is more than a bloke... he is a respected brother...

I would rather not speak about him, but only about what he has to say. And I hope others would do the same.

[Intoodeep]

respected by who?

hes on the same as Abu Muntasir etc - another disillusioned 'salafi'

[Abuz Zubair]

respected by those who have a sense of justice...

respected by those who respect him for his years of efforts.

The same goes for Abu Muntasir.

Everyone knows about the phase they are going through, and I think we all agree here that they have erred... But at least in light of their past good deeds, let us pray and hope that join us again.

[knowrass]

Everyone knows about the phase they are going through, and I think we all agree here that they have erred...

could somenone please clarify this "phase"? as i've come accross many people talking about it (even slandering them because of it :S)... so i'm really unaware about it's reality.

[Umm]

Post 9-11, 7/7 phase.

[Abuz Zubair]

could somenone please clarify this "phase"? as i've come accross many people talking about it (even slandering them because of it :S)... so i'm really unaware about it's reality.
There is very little benefit in discussing people and a lot more harm, often unrepairable harm.

There is great benefit in discussing ideas purely from an objective academic perspective, and hardly no harm.

Which is why I would opt for the second, with those who have a good past with respect to Da'wah and promotion of Sunna.

[abu_ibrahim]

You do know he did a conference last month with Abdul Hakim Murad and Habib al-Saqqaf.

Habib al-Saqqaf is a teacher at Dar al-Mustafa in Hadramaut in Yemen.

Abdul Hakim Murad is anti-Wahabi and finds every oppurtunity to attack them, even a Channel 4 documentary which has a agenda, instead of defending Islaam, he chose to side with them with his "Wahabi bashing".

What is the condition of the one who sits with grave worshippers?

[Ibn_Anas]

Assalamo alaikom

Abu Zubair, we understand what u r saying abt not going into talking ill abt these brothers. But surely we have a right to know why they are doing what they are doing. And if they dont tell us should we not keep away from such confussing information they are feeding us????????? Im sure their past good deeds dont give them license to go an create fitnah without being challanged?

Allah knows best

[Umm]

The problem with many JIMAS and ex-JIMAS (and Abu Aliya is just one of many) is that they really believed Muslims in this country had or have a permanent future. This is because da'wah was/is their field, and when that da'wah is in danger, and when they see Islam being unpopular, then they have sought to make it more palatable to the UK masses. Unfortunately, and inevitabely, that involves comromise and adoption of sufi ideas.

Sheikh Anwar once said, very prophetically, a number of years ago, that the only da'wah most British kaafirs are receptive to is sufism.

[abu_ibrahim]

Sheikh Anwar once said, very prophetically, a number of years ago, that the only da'wah most British kaafirs are receptive to is sufism.

Have you noticed that most of the Sufi speakers in the West are converts/reverts.

Nuh Ha Mim Keller
Abdul Hakim Murad
Hamza Yusuf
Zaid Shakir
Musa Furber
Gibril Haddad (Lebanese Christian. became "Muslim" at USA University)
Naeem Abdul Wali
Umar Faruq Abdullah
Abdul Azeez Fredericks

When some of them accept Islam, they still have their Jahilliyah and don't want to make too many changes, so Sufism is more appealing.

[Ibn_Anas]

so whats the solution.......

We knw why, and how they change....but what does that mean for the avg person?

[Umm Ahmed]

Maybe looking into their "how I came to islam stories" might shed some light. Maybe they were looking at budhism and hari khrishna and other mystic types of cults which led them to sufism.
Maybe sufis are the cuddly type, lots of reverts loose their families so are looking for an other family to care for them, there could be so many reasons why some reverts end up being sufis.
Such a fine line we walk through this dunnia , we can only hope and pray that Allaah allows us to remain on the path of guidence.

[gag order]

can someone give me the lowdown on JIMAS and how they differ with other groups of salafi orientation? and i would also like to know more about abu aliyyah.

[Abu_Zahid]

I had never heard of Abu Aaliyah until abouth a month ago..he was at a charity dinner speaking to help raise money for an islamic primary school in east london, mashaAllah.

I can see why ppl are reluctatnt to start talking about the slip ups of some public figures, as it involves treading a very fine line where ppl can easily fall into the sin of backbiting/slandering - and often these discussions can cause more harm than good, as unforutnately a lot of muslims have the conscious or subconcious attitude of "crossing names off the list", after finding a mistake made by a da'ee/scholar. The result is that ppl end up rejecting all the good from that person, which they and others could have benefited from. This is severe fitnah and it shud be understood as an obvious fact of life that every man will make mistakes, regardless of who he is.

However, on the other hand, I think it is important for muslims to be aware now, especially in a post-9/11 climate, of how trials and tribulations facing the ummah are serving as a filtration process, as can be seen with many ppl "selling out" certain aspects of the deen under this pressure. I think its important for us to understand this, be wary of it and draw the necessary lessons from examples around us, so that we learn from the mistakes of others - mistakes which we could very easily fall into ourselves, might i add, if we were also in the "spotlight" like these ppl (famous da'ees etc.) are.

I dont know anything about the situation of Abu Muntasir or Abu Aaliyah, but what i said above are just some general thoughts.

[ibnfaruk]

Assalamualaikum, Why dont those interested in both brothers, listen to their talks or maybe even ''talk to them'' hint, hint. That would help you understand them and their ideas. After that maybe one can make a fair assessment of their stances on different issues.

Allah swt knows best

[Abuz Zubair]

You do know he did a conference last month with Abdul Hakim Murad and Habib al-Saqqaf.

...
What is the condition of the one who sits with grave worshippers?

The one who sits with a graveworshipper is not necessarily a grave worshipper himself, although, he is still wrong in sharing a da'wah platform with him and his likes.

But surely we have a right to know why they are doing what they are doing. And if they dont tell us should we not keep away from such confussing information they are feeding us????????? Im sure their past good deeds dont give them license to go an create fitnah without being challanged?

Well... just go and ask them what they are doing. Whether their responses and explanations would be satisfactory or not is a different question. The little I know from them directly, and the little more I know about them indirectly, to me, is not satisfactory at all.

But again, they have erred, yet they are not like the Sufis...

The problem with many JIMAS and ex-JIMAS (and Abu Aliya is just one of many) is that they really believed Muslims in this country had or have a permanent future. This is because da'wah was/is their field, and when that da'wah is in danger, and when they see Islam being unpopular, then they have sought to make it more palatable to the UK masses. Unfortunately, and inevitabely, that involves comromise and adoption of sufi ideas.

Well, I too, believe we are here to stay... as I have said in other threads, that those who expect the Muslims to mass-migrate to somewhere else are living in cloud cuckoo land.

Although, this is where we split, as one may argue. I believe in asserting our identity and rights as much as possible, just as the gov. seeks to dilute our identity and rights as much as possible. Hence, according to my vision we require activism, confidence, independence, assertiveness, courage and bravery, in order to save us from erosion.

Others seem to be confused about their identity, and some of them have even begun to take pride in British History! Even the native English, Irish, Welsh Scottish people do not find much to take pride in British History that is crammed full of colonialism and plunder of other people's wealth.


Good post Abu Zahid,

Ibn Faruk,

Why dont those interested in both brothers, listen to their talks or maybe even ''talk to them'' hint, hint

Great idea... if they can be talked to, then please go ahead. It doesn't seem, however, that they are interested in listening to anyone at present.

Yes, many of their actions are wrong, and quite damaging in terms of the confusion it has spread amongst the Sunnis. The last straw for me was when Tariq Ramadan was invited to JIMAS, and people actually went back home with kufr beliefs.

Yet, what I am saying is that just because a person errs a couple of times or more, than should not blind us from their past efforts.

Look at the story of Hatib b. Abi Balta'a. One of the lessons learnt from the story is that even if a person commits a heinous crime (spying on Muslims), another good deed may outweigh that altogether (participation in the battle of Badr).

These two brothers (AbuM and AbuA) have produced generations of Salafis. Yes, they weren't perfect, and perhaps they shouldn't have assumed the position of leadership, but they did what was needed at the time, and their reward is with Allah.

It is unfair to say that they have become modernists or Sufis just because they mistakenly share platform with these people or promote them in their conferences.

Yes, if they say something wrong, then it should be refuted. no doubt. But balance is the keyword here.

And I guess, this is another lesson for us all that extremism in deen does one no good. Extremism leads to extremism. Most of those who have become Sufis or modernists were either extreme madkhalis or extreme jihadis.

[Skillganon]

And I guess, this is another lesson for us all that extremism in deen does one no good. Extremism leads to extremism. Most of those who have become Sufis or modernists were either extreme madkhalis or extreme jihadis.

Assalamu alaikum

Bro that is the part I don't understand, if indeed they where madkhalis than they should know about matters pertaining to bidah and shirk, even though they went exreme in the denounciation, how comes they did a complete u-turn.

Unless initially they did not understand why and what they where parroting and denouncing. That is probably the case in my reasoning.
I personally don't have experience with madkhalis.

Any thought anyone?

[asharee_salafi]

Wait.

Its not fair to mention the faults ( in a positive manner in terms of advice) of abu aliyah and not mention the the wrong doings of our noble brother abuz zubair on issues he misjudged the reality of.

Though we love him for the sake of Allah...we shouldn't let this stop us from carrying out justice.

we shoudn't forget many salafis sold out on the 'salafi methodology' ( if there was such a thing) not just JIMAS.

We disagreed with abuz zubair because he supported a pro rafidah Shia organisation by the name of hizb ut tahrir.

Brothers had tried to explain the many U tuns that HT have made, while at the same time accusing everyone else of being compromised. Brothers showed how this group was an oppurtunistic one, which was not out for the benefit of the Ummah, but was an actual cult....( and not a metaphorical one either).
Despite this, he poured scorn upon the enjoining of the Good of those brothers.

It was also shown how HT was faking Unity with other muslims just so to save themslves from a ban and at the same time backstabing other Muslims.
Brothers had tried to show how this group, via insider information, did not care one bit about the recent unity attempts they were trying to do, but had ulterior motives,

What was even stranger that he called for unity with this group when the CONDITIONS for unity were not being fulfiled, when HT were plotting and planiing against the Sunnis.

Furthermore whats even more bafflng is that HT is well known to be a pro muaztizilah organisation that legitimises asharee beliefs aswell as shia ones........and at the same time abuz zubair showed his disgust with the asharee aqeedah. Which was a contradiction.

I needed to say this to put things in perspective and I hope he won't mind.

Again its not fair to judge other brohers wrong doings and not ourselves.

[Yasir]

We disagreed with abuz zubair because he supported a pro rafidah Shia organisation by the name of hizb ut tahrir.Did he actually express absolute agreement with all their ideas and outlook as a group? Or did he in fact point out, after looking at the bigger picture, some of the perhaps better aspects associated with their group, in an era of heavy onslaught against all types of Muslim thought, and suggested there was room for some co-operation and unity on the issues which are fundamental to us all?

The idea that it is impossible for a group we disagree with to have any good in them is just odd. If anything that is more in keeping with the views of those who suggest that disagreement with them in a single matter should result in an "off-the-manhaj" stamp of disapproval.

It was mentioned in another thread that Sh. Abdullah Azzam said...
Just because you are part of a particular group doesn't mean that you are better than the people. Just because you read a particular book doesn't mean that you are better than the people. There is some good with the Ikhwan, and there is some good with the Tabligh, and there is some good with the Salafiyyah; every one of them has a portion of the good, so, try - if you are able - to collect all of the good from these groups. They used to study from a large group of the scholars, so, his Hadith instructor is different from his Tafsir instructor , and his instructor in spiritual nurturing is different from his Arabic language instructor. Take from the Tabligh their manners...and imagine if we were to follow their path in respecting the people, and their manners with the scholars... The Tabligh have very good speech, as they convey what they say and work magic on the hearts with their manners, and cause any envy one might have against them to vanish. Take from the Ikhwan their historical movements and revolutionary ideas, and take from the Salafiyyah their beliefs. Collect within yourself all that is good, become a student, and do not restrict the truth to your own shaykh... Take from this person, and take from that person; respect the people, and give them the credit they are due, and put them in their proper categories..."There are a lot of lessons in there, if only we could appreciate them.

At the same time, this doesn't mean that we should refrain from pointing out the mistakes of HT and others, and correcting them as appropriate in light of the sunnah; but that you should be able to maintain a balanced outlook, in view of the bigger picture.

[bamshaheed]

as salaamu ‘alaykum

After reading all the posts, I must admit, I have no idea what people are talking about here. I see the titles of “sufi,” “salafi,” “madkhalis,” and “jihadis” being thrown around like a child’s beach ball at a swimming pool party. What do we mean by these terms? Have any of these individuals come out and said, “I’m a sufi”? And when we say “sufi” what do we mean? Do they wear dresses and spin around in circles? Do they believe in soul transmigration? Do they believe they have “transcended” Islam? Are they telling people, “believe in more than one God”? Or is the title of “sufi” simply a derogatory term that we use now to describe people who do not interpret Islam as we feel they should?

Don’t misunderstand me, if an individual clearly claims to be a sufi, then he’s a sufi. Or, if he’s wearing a dress and spinning around in a circle claiming he’s “projecting his soul” and “transcending Islam” then bingo, he’s probably a sufi. But I fear we have reached the level that we place these titles on people simply because they don’t agree with what we believe, or our interpretation.

Can someone, anyone, provide some quotes from any of these individuals we are discussing here that would substantiate an accusation that they are “sufi” or anything else?

Jazakallahu Khair

[asharee_salafi]

Thats strange Yasir,

Whoever said I said he agreed with HT?!

Read my post again....the conditions of unity was not fulfilled.

What about Tariq Ramadhan then, would you share a platform with him?

[abu imaan an-nepalee]

I don't think it would be fair to equate the change in Abu 'Aliyah with that of Abuz-Zubair's position on unity with the parsitan politicians

this is because one brother has changed his manhaj while the other is a matter of changing an opinon with regards to approaching this group.


wa ALLAHU A'lam

[Abuz Zubair]

I didn't change my position with respect to anything or anyone, and yes, we can share a platform with Tariq Ramadan, or even Galloway, Tony Blair, or whoever the person, or however evil he may be, so long as the theme is something we agree on and concede to work together; if that's shocking enough for you.

For instance, what is wrong with working with the Jews, Christians and Qadianis on promoting decency and modesty in the society? Nothing.

And this is what Allah said in His Book: Cooperate on righteousness and piety, but do not cooperate on sins and transgression.

We need to be guided by principles and not emotions. Understand the principles first, and then try to apply it, otherwise, you will fall like the first generation of UK Salafis.


Now, I never said 'do not criticise HT'. All I said is do not be obsessed with HT. You feel betrayed, fine. But now is the time to move on.

Yes, I was softer on HTs even though they are closer to Mu'tazila, than the rest of the Ash'aris, even though they are theologically closer to us, primarily because HTs were under attack for beliefs that we hold dear to ourselves. Meaning, in this respect, their loss is our loss, and hence, it was a problem common to us all.

If people like Hamza Yusuf and others stood for the political aspects of Islam as HTs do, and were ever attacked, I would rather that they are not attacked from within. I would hold my guns and speak in their support, because their defeat is my defeat. But the sad thing is that these Ash'ari-Sufis are active participants of the 'radical middle way'. They are part of this global war on Islam; not a military part but an ideological part; a fifth column, and this is why they prove to be more dangerous than HT.


But as I have said ten times or more, your problem is that you seem to be very badly burnt by these people, and therefore, you are being very emotional and reactionary. You do not have any principles to dictate to you as to when and how you should cooperate and with whom, or when to attack or retreat. And in your fury, you fail to understand the next person's perspective.

And to shock you even more, no there is nothing wrong with cooperate and sharing a platform with Hamza Yusuf and Abdul-Hakim Murad, depending on what the theme is about.

[waziri]

Maybe abu imaan or ashari salafi could start a thread about the good points of HT?

Then again maybe not

[abu imaan an-nepalee]

Maybe abu imaan or ashari salafi could start a thread about the good points of HT?

Then again maybe not

why not? Interesting you said that because I was thinking to do that because I read in a newsletter I got from them on jummah about some da'wah work a brother I know called Majid Nawaz was doing with the drug-affected youth in east london, and it may surprise you but i was quite happy that there was this work being done wal-lillahil-hamd! But i've lost that leaflet.

I have mentioned on this forum and theirs good and bad points. So what if predominantly bad points, but I don't think the points I mentioned or discuss anyone would disagree.

I don't also see a problem with co-operating with ht, however I have my reservations due to discraceful actions some of their members did when I was at my last university when I tried to bring the ISOC and HT brothers together but it was the HT brothers who not only would have their sly manouvers but we were literally backstabbed and "eliminated" in some ways from their plans!

Ironically the last straw was them "eliminating" us from the organisation of a talk that I suggested to them to do! ALLAHU Musta'an!


Yes, I was softer on HTs even though they are closer to Mu'tazila, than the rest of the Ash'aris, even though they are theologically closer to us, primarily because HTs were under attack for beliefs that we hold dear to ourselves. Meaning, in this respect, their loss is our loss, and hence, it was a problem common to us all.


Sorry brother, when I ment "change" it was infact your softer approach to them that I ment. I don't know if you knew this but when we would have "rucks" with the "salafi Isoc" you came down a few times to give jummah khutbah and talks, the brothers would say "you got a problem with what abuz zubair has got to say? come and talk to him then!"

By this i mean the salafis brothers would "threaten" the ht with you (lol!) if we stepped out of line. (that was besides the numerous attempts to "man-handle us like it was wwf royal rumble! lol! ;) )

Man it was my first year at uni, and to be honest all of us were scared to approach you, from what the salafis ISOC would say, and from the rep you had with the shabab and your face-to-face discussions you were known as the one who most would want to avoid and hated ht, and then there was that funny site insideht.com etc and so you have to understand in that light what I mean, not from the angle of "co-operation" I don't think anyone here can say they wouldn't co-operate with neo-mu'tazilah, jahmiyyah etc.

However I don't know about this murad guy, he seems really like he doesn't have any principles and would attack salafis with kuffar media even if the actual attack is upon the agreed upon matters! a'udhu billahi min dhalik!

wa ALLAHU A'lam

[Abuz Zubair]

Yes... I remember those days, too. We've all had bad experiences with HTs. My hostile attitude towards them was due to my experience with the Kingston lot, who I think were the worst of them all in terms of everything, really.

Even the three stooges we have here, as I have told them many times, are doing no service to their cause. If anything, they are making people hate not only HT, but also the core message they want to give, until people begin to hate even the idea of Khilafa. And this is the problem with trying to push an agenda so overtly as they do. It is the approach and attitude of these younger brothers that overshadow any good work their group might have done. Although, I might be able to look beyond these younger HTs here, to the more mature and reasonable HTs, I am sure others cannot see that. To them, HT is simply what they see in the three stooges.

And yes, Murad is the most twisted of the lot, perhaps, but he is still a Muslim. We surely cannot share a platform with him on Islam, or even civil liberties, but if there ever was a common ground between us, then there is no harm in sharing a platform with him on that.

[abu_ibrahim]

And yes, Murad is the most twisted of the lot, perhaps, but he is still a Muslim. We surely cannot share a platform with him on Islam, or even civil liberties, but if there ever was a common ground between us, then there is no harm in sharing a platform with him on that.

Are you sure he is a Muslim? Considering he is admired by the grave worshippers.

This idea of sharing platforms doesn't seem right to me. On Civil liberties, I don't see any harm in having people come, who are left wing or are human rights activists. However I have a problem with sharing platforms with deviant Muslims on Islamic issues.

[abu imaan an-nepalee]

maybe we can open an new thread on co-operation, innsha'ALLAH

yeah man those kingston HT, your right they are really bad man, really bad, even the shabab of HT say that!

3 stooges? I thought there were 2?

And I agree I said before they ain't doing HT a service, I know other shabab are much better maasha'ALLAH

[abudurrah]

we can share a platform with Tariq Ramadan, or even Galloway, Tony Blair, or whoever the person, or however evil he may be, so long as the theme is something we agree on and concede to work together; if that's shocking enough for you.

let me guess who u wouldnt share a platform with...???

i always thought cooperating on the good deeds meant only with muslims, i wouldnt cooperate in anything with e.g qaadiyani type groups

no need to reply to this post.

[Abuz Zubair]

Are you sure he is a Muslim? Considering he is admired by the grave worshippers.

This idea of sharing platforms doesn't seem right to me. On Civil liberties, I don't see any harm in having people come, who are left wing or are human rights activists. However I have a problem with sharing platforms with deviant Muslims on Islamic issues.
ُExactly... this is why I said, depending on what the theme is, we can cooperate with anyone.

But this blanket statement: 'we don't cooperate with anyone but Muslims, and even amongst the Muslims, we do not cooperate with anyone but a Sunni, and even amongst Sunnis we do not cooperate with anyone who disrespects Bin Ladin or Zawahiri, etc, etc...'

It is people with this sort of unprincipled mindset that never get anywhere in life.

Look at abudurrah, for instance.

[Abuz Zubair]

Are you sure he is a Muslim? Considering he is admired by the grave worshippers.


Well, the Asl is that he is a Muslim since he has said the shahadatayn... I haven't seen a statement from him espousing Shirk, yet... so I cannot make a judgement on assumption, no matter how strong it may be.

[Abuz Zubair]

let me guess who u wouldnt share a platform with...???

You lot... (the Muharrijun)

[abudurrah]

we can share a platform with Tariq Ramadan, or even Galloway, Tony Blair, or whoever the person, or however evil he may be so long as the theme is something we agree on and concede to work together; if that's shocking enough for you.

except
You lot... (the Muharrijun)

it doesnt bother me that u said im sure thers alot of stuff wrong with muhajiroun but it does bother me that u share platform with the shirki type people and kuffar and look for themes to to cooperate on.

Mr principles. enough from me.

[Abuz Zubair]

just cos i was cultured by them, u make a lot of judgemts about me personally which are wrong.

By attempting to organise a rowdy mob hackling Yasir Qadhi at QMW on al-Muharrijun forums, you don't do yourselves any favours.

Try to be here what you are elsewhere...

but it does bother me that u share platform with the shirki type people and kuffar and look for themes to to cooperate on.

Well, because other people, even shirki ones have agendas that we all agree on. With the hopeless al-Muharrijun, I really cannot think of anything we can cooperate on. Your only agenda seems to be to generate publicity, whether good or bad ( and a bad one in nearly all cases. But then again, not much is expected of an org directed by a pot-belly clown who is suspected of being an MI5 agent.)

[Abu Dharr Al Kashmiri]

Asalaam'Alaykum,

Abu Aaliyah was in town yesterday, sorry brothers i didnt stop to get his signature for you all. He's ok-ish, a brother in Islam, May Allah swt guide us all to the straight path. Aameen

[Student_of_Knowledge]

Salamo_Laikum,

Just read Abu-Aaliyah's "Dhahabi's Gifts of Gold (1 & 2)", Masha'Allah very nice work indeed.

http://web.mac.com/jawziyyah/The_Jawziyyah_Institute/Reading_Room.html

[Abu Ma'mar]

Just read Abu-Aaliyah's "Dhahabi's Gifts of Gold (1 & 2)", Masha'Allah very nice work indeed.

nice jk bro

[Student_of_Knowledge]

nice jk bro
Sorry, I beg your pardon?

[hkrespect]

Sorry, I beg your pardon?

jk - jazakhullakhayr?

[anam]

yeah but you never spelt it correctly:D



lool
Abu Zubaiir im sure your disaproval for bakri has gone to extremes..you mentioned he's accused of being mi5 agent!!! omg lol

also remember akhee as you would say
he is Muslim,
therefore talking about him in a way that he wouldn't like is enough to sin,

i aggree one shouldn't be serious when talking knowledge from him but let's be just..maybe he's clamed down these days and teaches fiqh hadeeth etc although have heard him on paltalk saying things i wouldnt advise new muslims or those with little understanding to hear.

[Abuz Zubair]

Do not make excuses for him if you do not know him and have never dealt with him. I have first hand experience with him, and so do others. My experience tells me that he is a confirmed liar and a pot-belly clown, and I will say this at the top of my voice.

al-Hamdulillah, there are also other brothers who have had the same sort of experiences with him and share my views. Our views are a result of our own first hand experiences with him and we are well within the right to speak as ill of the clown as Sharia permits.

[anam]

well akhee i can't disagree with you ,
you must have strong reasons which you dont need to go into..i also have mine so as you said you are free from the hadeeth attributing sin to the doer insh'Allaah, and yes i have heard from a brother who is knowledgable who Bakri knew from way back who has told me , well not much he is humble character but said mainly he has bidaah while pulling a face you would pull when you disliked the smell of something for example.

But do you seriously think he is an agent?

[Abuz Zubair]

But do you seriously think he is an agent?

No I don't think he is. I have never said he is. All I said, is looking at his track record, either he is extremely twisted self-obsessed individual, or he is an agent. I don't have any proof for the latter, and hence it is only a possibility.