Wahabi terrorist confesses he's gay in iraq

[umm lina]

What a shame!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xayVrJiezA

[Brother_Mujahid]

What is a shame is that you are spreading Iraqi "government" propaganda. These are people that were coheresed into ridiculous confessions on the "government" television. It appears that you are just a schill for the Rawaafid regime and the American occupation. The man claims that Shaykh Abdul-Aziz Aal ash-Shaikh gave a fatwa in support of the jihad in Iraq, when he did not such thing. He called it "fitnah", etc. You are ridiculous.

[gag order]

he keeps rolling his eyes as if to access the creativity centres of the brain, the frontal lobe

[Abu Sabaya]

Actually, this whole interview was done under coercion.

The brother who is being questioned was kidnapped by the Iraqi police force, as were all of the women in his family. He was threatened with having them all raped in front of his eyes if he did not go on TV and say that he committed homosexual acts in the mosque, the result of which is the interview posted above.

Later on, some Mujahidin in Iraq captured the policemen who were involved in the kidnapping of the brother's family, and exacted a videotaped confession that the brother is completely innocent of what he was forced to admit to.

I believe this confession is featured near the beginning of the 'Ghazwat ash-Shaykh 'Umar Hadid' video.

[umm lina]

What is a shame is that you are spreading Iraqi "government" propaganda. These are people that were coheresed into ridiculous confessions on the "government" television. It appears that you are just a schill for the Rawaafid regime and the American occupation. The man claims that Shaykh Abdul-Aziz Aal ash-Shaikh gave a fatwa in support of the jihad in Iraq, when he did not such thing. He called it "fitnah", etc. You are ridiculous.
There's nothing ridiculous about this video.No doubt that this man was under
torture but if he really chose what ever he thought was right he had to stand for it and fear only Allah like our prophet's(saw) companions.They feared only Allah and they died for his cause.There's no paradise with no sacrifices besides I didn't mention anything that showed that i'm spreading iraqi government propaganda.

[Brother_Mujahid]

There's nothing ridiculous about this video.No doubt that this man was under
torture but if he really chose what ever he thought was right he had to stand for it and fear only Allah like our prophet's(saw) companions.They feared only Allah and they died for his cause.There's no paradise with no sacrifices besides I didn't mention anything that showed that i'm spreading iraqi government propaganda.

Yes you did mention something, referring to the man as a "Wahhabi terrorist" who was "confessing" he was gay. As for what the man said, well torture and threat of torture can make people say alot of things. But of course I'm sure you've endured ruthless torture (such as rape, being sodomized, beaten, electricuted genitals, etc) to be able to judge him in such a self-righteous and condescending manner.

[Abu Ilyas]

Yes you did mention something, referring to the man as a "Wahhabi terrorist" who was "confessing" he was gay. As for what the man said, well torture and threat of torture can make people say alot of things. But of course I'm sure you've endured ruthless torture (such as rape, being sodomized, beaten, electricuted genitals, etc) to be able to judge him in such a self-righteous and condescending manner.

Well said.

[umm lina]

Yes you did mention something, referring to the man as a "Wahhabi terrorist" who was "confessing" he was gay. As for what the man said, well torture and threat of torture can make people say alot of things. But of course I'm sure you've endured ruthless torture (such as rape, being sodomized, beaten, electricuted genitals, etc) to be able to judge him in such a self-righteous and condescending manner.
I'm not a hero but this man is supposed to be one.He is a holder of a great message of Islam remember what Malcolm X said:
"A man who stands for nothing will fall for anything." - Malcolm X

[Abu_Abdillah2000]

I'm not a hero but this man is supposed to be one.

Um Lina, enough please! If you're not a hero, that is no excuse for you to judge him in the way you did. In fact, you should be more ashamed of saying such a thing when you admit that you wouldn't do any better in the circumstances!

[lojt2001]

Of course there is no such thing as a gay Muslim!!!!! It must be a lie.

Or does he instantly become an apostate as soon as he realises he is gay?

What do you think should happen to gay people????

[1mran]

Lets remember the story of Ibn yasir

The Sahaabee who accepted Islaam as a slave and was tortured to the point of death to renounce his belief. He complied with his master’s demand and falsely admitted that the Prophet was a magician and that the Makkan idols were his gods. After being released from torture, Ammaar Ibn Yaasir avoided the Prophet’s company out of shame for what had said; especially since both his father, Yaasir, and his mother, Sumayyah, chose to be tortured to death rather than deny their belief in Allaah and His Prophet. When the Prophet learned of Ammaar’s feelings of shame, he called for him and asked him about the state of his heart. Ammaar replied that it was full of Eemaan (belief), so the Prophet said, “If they repeat the torture repeat what you said.”
Then Allaah revealed the following verse,

Whoever disbelieved in Allâh after his belief, except him who is forced thereto and whose heart is at rest with Faith but such as open their breasts to disbelief, on them is wrath from Allâh, and theirs will be a great torment. (An-Nahl 16:106)

[Collected by al-Bayhaqee and quoted in Ibn Katheer’s Tafseer al Qur’aan al Adheem ]

So if the brother was forced, we probably shouldnt focus on attacking him, but asking oursleves what we can do to help him and others like him.

Remember, these people know that the Mujahideen do not fear death. so what they are doing is using the trickery of shaytan. by this man apparently confessing he is gay, it brings a lot of fitnah.

This is just like how the jews tried to cause fitnah by saying they had coverted and leaving Islam staright after

And a party of the people of the Scripture say: "Believe in the morning in that which is revealed to the believers (Muslims), and reject it at the end of the day, so that they may turn back. (Aali Imran 3:72)

And believe no one except the one who follows your religion. Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Verily! Right guidance is the Guidance of Allâh" and do not believe that anyone can receive like that which you have received (of Revelation) except when he follows your religion, otherwise they would engage you in argument before your Lord. Say (O Muhammad SAW): "All the bounty is in the Hand of Allâh; He grants to whom He wills. And Allâh is All-Sufficient for His creatures' needs, the All-Knower." (Aali Imran 3:73)

He selects for His Mercy (Islâm and the Qur'ân with Prophethood) whom He wills and Allâh is the Owner of Great Bounty. (Aali Imran 3:74)

------------------------------------------


and Allah knows best

[Umm Ahmed]

Of course there is no such thing as a gay Muslim!!!!! It must be a lie.

Or does he instantly become an apostate as soon as he realises he is gay?

What do you think should happen to gay people????


There are homosexuals that are muslims, and no it does not take one out of Islaam if he does have that tendancy . Do you know the story of Lot Lojt ?

[1mran]

There are homosexuals that are muslims, and no it does not take one out of Islaam if he does have that tendancy . Do you know the story of Lot Lojt ?


I thought it does. isnt the punishment death? and werent the people of Lut Killed because of this (and ofcourse not worshipping Allah)

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas said: “The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “… cursed is the one who has intercourse with an animal, cursed is the one who does the action of the people of Loot.”

(Narrated by Ahmad, 1878. This hadeeth was classed as saheeh by Shaykh al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’, no. 5891).

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas said: “The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: ‘Whoever you find doing the deed of the people of Loot, kill the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.”

(Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1456; Abu Dawood, 4462; Ibn Maajah, 2561. This hadeeth was classed as saheeh by Shaykh al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’, no. 6589).

could you please post the story of Lot Lojt

Jazakillahu khayrn

[Abd al-Haqq Marshall]

I thought it does. isnt the punishment death? and werent the people of Lut Killed because of this (and ofcourse not worshipping Allah)

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas said: “The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “… cursed is the one who has intercourse with an animal, cursed is the one who does the action of the people of Loot.”

(Narrated by Ahmad, 1878. This hadeeth was classed as saheeh by Shaykh al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’, no. 5891).

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas said: “The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: ‘Whoever you find doing the deed of the people of Loot, kill the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.”

(Narrated by al-Tirmidhi, 1456; Abu Dawood, 4462; Ibn Maajah, 2561. This hadeeth was classed as saheeh by Shaykh al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’, no. 6589).

could you please post the story of Lot Lojt

Jazakillahu khayrn

Homosexuality is a major sin, and the punishment is death, but it is not kufr. A person would only be a kaafir if they believed that homosexuality is OK. If they practice homosexuality but are ashamed of it, they are still a believer.

[1mran]

Homosexuality is a major sin, and the punishment is death, but it is not kufr. A person would only be a kaafir if they believed that homosexuality is OK. If they practice homosexuality but are ashamed of it, they are still a believer.



ahh yes, obviously! that makes sense!

but, would you say that it falls in the same category as adultery and Alcohol?

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "When an adulterer commits illegal sexual intercourse, then he is not a believer at the time, he is doing it, and when a drinker of an alcoholic liquor drinks it, then he is not a believer at the time of drinking it, and when a thief steals, then he is not a believer at the time of stealing, and when a robber robs, and the people look at him, then he is not a believer at the time of doing robbery.

[Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 43, Number 655]

[gag order]

I'm not a hero but this man is supposed to be one.He is a holder of a great message of Islam remember what Malcolm X said:
"A man who stands for nothing will fall for anything." - Malcolm X

islam does not require that a mujahid pass himself off as a 'hero' since it is said regarding the fighter who fights for fame and to be remembered for his heroism, that he would be flung headfirst into hell. therefore he is NOT supposed be a hero at all !

also, the qoute from malcolm X is irrelevant since it was spoken by someone who lived in comparative ease and freedom without the threat from collaborators, death squads, special forces, CIA, gunships, renditions, guantanamo, abu ghraib etc etc...

[Brother_Mujahid]

Well said brother Gag Order. Umm Lina, I must say your bigotry and hatred for those Muslims who are defending their religion, families, and property is quite pathetic. Now I know why many of the brothers suspect you are a Raafid'i.

[1mran]

islam does not require that a mujahid pass himself off as a 'hero' since it is said regarding the fighter who fights for fame and to be remembered for his heroism, that he would be flung headfirst into hell. therefore he is NOT supposed be a hero at all !

also, the qoute from malcolm X is irrelevant since it was spoken by someone who lived in comparative ease and freedom without the threat from collaborators, death squads, special forces, CIA, gunships, renditions, guantanamo, abu ghraib etc etc...

Thats right


It has been narrated on the authority of Sulaiman b. Yasar who said:

People dispersed from around Abu Huraira, and Natil, who was from the Syrians. said to him: O Shaikh, relate (to us) a tradition you have heard from the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him). He said: Yes. I heard the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) say: The first of men (whose case) will be decided on the Day of Judgment will be a man who died as a martyr. He shall be brought (before the Judgment Seat). Allah will make him recount His blessings (i. e. the blessings which He had bestowed upon him) and he will recount them (and admit having enjoyed them in his life). (Then) will Allah say: What did you do (to requite these blessings)? He will say: I fought for Thee until I died as a martyr. Allah will say: You have told a lie. You fought that you might be called a" brave warrior". And you were called so. (Then) orders will be passed against him and he will be dragged with his face downward and cast into Hell. Then will be brought forward a man who acquired knowledge and imparted it (to others) and recited the Qur'an. He will be brought And Allah will make him recount His blessings and he will recount them (and admit having enjoyed them in his lifetime). Then will Allah ask: What did you do (to requite these blessings)? He will say: I acquired knowledge and disseminated it and recited the Qur'an seeking Thy pleasure. Allah will say: You have told a lie. You acquired knowledge so that you might be called" a scholar," and you recited the Qur'an so that it might be said:" He is a Qari" and such has been said. Then orders will be passed against him and he shall be dragged with his face downward and cast into the Fire. Then will be brought a man whom Allah had made abundantly rich and had granted every kind of wealth. He will be brought and Allah will make him recount His blessings and he will recount them and (admit having enjoyed them in his lifetime). Allah will (then) ask: What have you done (to requite these blessings)? He will say: I spent money in every cause in which Thou wished that it should be spent. Allah will say: You are lying. You did (so) that it might be said about (You):" He is a generous fellow" and so it was said. Then will Allah pass orders and he will be dragged with his face downward and thrown into Hell.

[Sahih Muslim, Book 020, Number 4688]


but i disagree about what u said about Malcolm X. he was there at a time black people were having a very difficult time, and to add to that, he had a sect of Muslims out to kill him, infact they later did.

Although the Mujahid should not be arrogant, he should not expose his weakness either.

this is why, for example, its allowed for the Mujahid to dye his hair black, so as to look young. or thats why some ulema have said that they can use drums in battle so as to scare the other side. even when the sahabah did tawaf when they came to makkah, was it not fast?

If this man is infact gay, he should have seaked scholarly advice and hidden his sins from others.

Allah knows best

[aburasheed]

ahh yes, obviously! that makes sense!

but, would you say that it falls in the same category as adultery and Alcohol?

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "When an adulterer commits illegal sexual intercourse, then he is not a believer at the time, he is doing it, and when a drinker of an alcoholic liquor drinks it, then he is not a believer at the time of drinking it, and when a thief steals, then he is not a believer at the time of stealing, and when a robber robs, and the people look at him, then he is not a believer at the time of doing robbery.

[Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 43, Number 655]
There are many levels of Iman. In the hadith in english it's translated as "a believer", but it's actually a specific level of Iman which is "Mukmin". I found this image from the al-Maghrib class notes:

http://an-nabawi.com/private/al-imran/levels_of_iman.jpg

[1mran]

Assalam alaikum,

It was translated by dr Muhsin Khan, from University of Medinah.

so he probably knows a thing or two about words..

but are you saying the verse actually means that a person has low imaan when committing these acts?

maybe he understood the haidth by using other ahadith and quranic text?

Allah knows best

[Umm]

Wasn't it Ali (RA) who used to rule that the homos should be taken to somewhere high and thrown to land on a sharp point? I guess that is poetic justice!

[1mran]

The Sahaabah were unanimously agreed on the execution of homosexuals, but they differed as to how they were to be executed. Some of them were of the view that they should be burned with fire, which was the view of ‘Ali (may Allaah be pleased with him) and also of Abu Bakr (may Allaah be pleased with him), as we shall see below. And some of them thought that they should be thrown down from a high place then have stones thrown at them. This was the view of Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allaah be pleased with him).

Abu Bakr al-Siddeeq, ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib, Khaalid ibn al-Waleed, ‘Abd-Allaah ibn al-Zubayr, ‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Abbaas, Maalik, Ishaaq ibn Raahawayh, Imam Ahmad according to the more sound of the two reports from him and al-Shaafa’i according to one of his opinions, were of the view that the punishment for homosexuality should be more severe than the punishment for zina, and the punishment is execution in all cases, whether the person is married or not

Al-Shaafa’i, according to the well-known view of his madhhab, and Imam Ahmad according to the other report narrated from him, were of the view that the punishment for the homosexual should be the same as the punishment for the adulterer.

Imam Abu Haneefah was of the view that the punishment for the homosexual should be less severe than the punishment for the adulterer, and it is a punishment to be determined by the judge (ta’zeer).

Those who favoured the first view, who are the majority of the ummah – and more than one scholar narrated that there was consensus among the Sahaabah on this point – said that there is no sin that brings worse consequences than homosexuality, and they are second only to the evil consequences of kufr, and they may be worse than the consequences of murder, as we shall see below in sha Allaah.

It is narrated from Khaalid ibn al-Waleed that he found a man among one of the Arab tribes with whom men would have intercourse as with a woman. He wrote to Abu Bakr al-Siddeeq (may Allaah be pleased with him) and Abu Bakr al-Siddeeq consulted the Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them). ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib had the strongest opinion of all of them, and he said: “No one did that but one of the nations, and you know what Allaah did to them. I think that he should be burned with fire.” So Abu Bakr wrote to Khaalid and he had him burned.

‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Abbaas said: The highest point in the town should be found and the homosexual should be thrown head first from it, then stones should be thrown at him.

Ibn ‘Abbaas derived this hadd punishment from the punishment that Allaah sent upon the homosexuals of the people of Loot.

Ibn ‘Abbaas is the one who narrated from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) the words: “Whoever you find doing the action of the people of Loot, execute the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.” This was narrated by the authors of al-Sunan and was classed as saheeh by Ibn Hibbaan and others. Imam Ahmad quoted this hadeeth as evidence, and its isnaad meets the conditions of al-Bukhaari.

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: With regard to homosexuality, some of the scholars said that the hadd punishment for it is the same as the hadd punishment for zina, and it was said that it is less than that. But the correct view on which the Sahaabah were unanimously agreed is that both are to be killed, the active and the passive partners, whether they are married or not. The authors of al-Sunan narrated from Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever you find doing the action of the people of Loot, execute the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.” And Abu Dawood narrated from Ibn ‘Abbaas concerning the unmarried person who commits a homosexual act that he said: He is to be stoned. And something similar was narrated from ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib (may Allaah be pleased with him). The Sahaabah did not differ concerning the ruling that the homosexual is to be executed, but they differed concerning the methods. It was narrated from Abu Bakr al-Siddeeq (may Allaah be pleased with him) that he is to be burned, and from others that he is to be executed.

It was narrated from some of them that a wall is to be knocked down on top of him until he dies beneath it.

And it is said that both should be detained in the foulest of places until they die.

It was narrated from some of them that he should be taken up to the highest place in the town and thrown down from it, to be followed with stones, as Allaah did to the people of Loot. This was narrated from Ibn ‘Abbaas. According to the other report, he is to be stoned. This was the view of the majority of the salaf. They said: because Allaah stoned the people of Loot, and stoning is prescribed for the zaani by analogy with the stoning of the homosexual. Both are to be stoned, whether they are free or slaves, or one of them is the slave of the other, if they have reached the age of puberty. If one of them has not reached the age of puberty, he is to be punished but not stoned, and none is to be stoned except one who has reached puberty. End quote from al-Siyaasah al-Shar’iyyah, p. 138


http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=38622&ln=eng

[aburasheed]

Assalam alaikum,

It was translated by dr Muhsin Khan, from University of Medinah.

so he probably knows a thing or two about words..

but are you saying the verse actually means that a person has low imaan when committing these acts?

maybe he understood the haidth by using other ahadith and quranic text?

Allah knows best
It means that the person at the time of committing the sins are no longer at the level of a Mukmin until he repents his sins.

[1mran]

It means that the person at the time of committing the sins are no longer at the level of a Mukmin until he repents his sins.

yes, ofcourse. it says "at the time", so while they are doing the act

whats the definition of Mukmin?

[aburasheed]

yes, ofcourse. it says "at the time", so while they are doing the act

whats the definition of Mukmin?

It's clearly defined in the Quran:
http://studentmasjid.com/modules/Quran/index.php?op=viewayat&surano=23

[knowrass]

It's clearly defined in the Quran:
http://studentmasjid.com/modules/Quran/index.php?op=viewayat&surano=23

i think the brother was asking because u spelt mu'min with a K, so it must have made him think you meant something else.

[aburasheed]

i think the brother was asking because u spelt mu'min with a K, so it must have made him think you meant something else.
Jazakallah for pointing that out. I was just trying to point out that there are levels of Iman. When you read hadith like the one that brother 1mran mentioned (translated as "believer"), someone may misunderstood that a person becomes a disbeliever when he commits a sin, nauzubillah.

When someone commits a sin he his no longer at a level of a "Mu'min" and put himself into a risk of going to the hellfire, but he's still a believer (muslim).

[1mran]

Jazakallah for pointing that out. I was just trying to point out that there are levels of Iman. When you read hadith like the one that brother 1mran mentioned (translated as "believer"), someone may misunderstood that a person becomes a disbeliever when he commits a sin, nauzubillah.

When someone commits a sin he his no longer at a level of a "Mu'min" and put himself into a risk of going to the hellfire, but he's still a believer (muslim).

oh. Mu'min.!

yes, the hadith says he is not longer a believer WHEN they are doing the prohibited act. so if he dies will drinking, he wouldnt be a muslim.

however, once he finished drinking, he's just a sinner.

is there something about his salah not being accepeted for 40 days? subhanallah, cant rememeber.

anyway, he would need Repent

and Allah knows best