How much of British culture is Halal

[Abuz Zubair]

Here is an interesting question... How much of the British culture is in harmony with Islam and how much of it contradicts?

Obviously, we have adopted a lot of things from the culture we live in, no doubt. This isn't something we can help. Many of this habits are indeed, good, whilst others aren't.

So how much of the British culture can we adopt?

And culture could be anything from playing football on Saturdays to saying: 'Alright Love?' to a strange woman on the street!

[MosDef]

Fish & Chips is ok if they keep the oil pork free. However this could be classified as harming the body like smoking. :)

[Umm Ahmed]

Nice and neat pegged out washing, instead of drapping it over the neighbours hedges and fences.

Spending time on the garden.

Wearing socks with open toed sandals.

Washing meals down with a cup of tea.

Stew , shepherd pie , and apple crumble.

Going to car boot sales.

Chatting with the neighbour over the hedge. (females)

Blueberry and rasberry picking .

allotments.

The Bowls ( the one on the grass)

Fishing

cricket

[Umm]

Wearing socks with open toed sandals.

I told my son that is haram in our house, as it makes him look like he has just jumped "off the boat" :)

I guess we are used to queing and not shoving.

[gag order]

So how much of the British culture can we adopt?sorry, but to what end?

[Abuz Zubair]

to no end in particular.

if we live in a society, we take many of its values whether we like it or not, whether we know it or not.

the fact that we have adopted many things is given, so the question is, what of it is Islamically ok and what isn't.

[nomad]

saying please and thankyou

[umm hasan]

Not jumping cues

[Yasir]

- Moaning about Monday mornings
- Talking about the weather
- Using 'Sorry' as a prefix to a question
- Apologising when someone bumps into you!

I enjoyed reading this book a while back...

http://www3.waterstones.com/wat/images/nbd/l/97/9780340818862.jpg

In "Watching The English" anthropologist Kate Fox takes a revealing look at the quirks, habits and foibles of the English people. She puts the English national character under her anthropological microscope, and finds a strange and fascinating culture, governed by complex sets of unspoken rules and byzantine codes of behaviour. The rules of weather-speak. The ironic-gnome rule. The reflex apology rule. The paranoid-pantomime rule. Class indicators and class anxiety tests. The money-talk taboo and many more ...Through a mixture of anthropological analysis and her own unorthodox experiments (using herself as a reluctant guinea-pig), Kate Fox discovers what these unwritten behaviour codes tell us about Englishness.'She has not only compiled a comprehensive list of English qualities, she has examined them in depth and wondered how we came to acquire them. Her book is a delightful read.' -- The Sunday Times

'I loved the section on mobile-phone etiquette. Shrewd ... I liked the chapter on English humour. This is an entertaining, clever book. Do read it and then pass it on.' -- Daily Telegraph

'Amusing ... entertaining.' -- The Times

'Watching the English ... will make you laugh out loud ("Oh God. I do that!") and cringe simultaneously ("Oh God. I do that as well."). This is a hilarious book which just shows us for what we are ... beautifully-observed. It is a wonderful read for both the English and those who look at us and wonder why we do what we do. Now they'll know.' -- Birmingham Post

'Fascinating reading.' -- Oxford Times

'An absolutely brilliant examination of English culture and how foreigners take as complete mystery the things we take for granted.' -- Jennifer Saunders, The Times

'If you like this kind of anthropology (and I do) there is a wealth of it to enjoy in this book. Her observations are acute...fortunately she doesn't write like an anthropologist but like an English woman -with amusement, not solemnity, able to laugh at herself as well as us.' -- Daily Mail

[nomad]

why dont the passport people just make all applicants read something like that, instead of taking some test about useless facts of the british isles. Ithink i'll buy it for someone i know...might shed some light upon some issues.

[defenderofbusharraf]

i dont think there is anything intrinsic to british culture that is admirable......anything that has been mentioned above is largely generic and can be applied to any nation or land essentially.........whether is drinking tea after a meal, starting small talk with the weather, or saying sorry when bumping into someone.......
the only thing admirable about the kuffar way of life is how they r a people who adhere to rules and systems and therefore have progressed technologically and industrially far above the other nations.....the kuffar western nations especially have clear methodologies and processes to deal with situations and bring about change, thereby minimising chaos in their societies and so by extension they progress and modernise, allowing them to have what u see today, advanced technology in machines, industry, economy, arms etc etc etc......all of which enable them to subjugate other peoples, especially the muslims........

other than that, i would say that how much they have advanced inductrially and technologically, they have twice as much regressed socially, in their values and beliefs......

probably worse than animals actually, cuz animals dont have a choice about how they act, its in their nature....human beings on the other hand have a choice.

unfortunately i had to be born in this cess pool called Great Britain.......khair...Allah hu alam

[Abul-Fadl]

well a lot of that is true, but when it comes to justice Britain is century's ahead of all muslim country's and even ahead of its western neighbors.

I think that maybe this justice and equality (among its inhabitants) was one of the reasons that lead to so many immigrants abandoning their religions which they (through bad tarbia) linked solely to their country's, and i don't doubt that this is one of the reasons that gave rise the modernism movement(that and £££).

Sadly, however, the muslim community in uk hasn't fully grasped this part of British culture, that is the most halal of them all .

[AbuAliTheRoman]

I guess the racism here is sometimes better than the racism 'back home', I mean to say you racist in the UK is ashameful, where i have had some Muslims boast about being racist, and boast about their culture and be far more fierce in upholding bigotted racist views especially in regards to their daughters marrying Muslims of differnet castes, races, etc.

To openly insult someone due to his colour/origin here (London) on the street you would find people coming to your aid, even though they share the accusers background.

I even know one individual, an Imam, who when he arrived in the 70s in the heyday of Teddy Boys, Skinheads and Mods, a group of racists wanted to brick his house, and his neighbours who were skinheads came out to protect him and his family.

When i see and here about things like this, I try and stay balanced, so I dont over love a person, because one day he may become dislikable to me. And likewise the reverse.

[walid]

Being called paki several times a year or asked when are you Edited going home & explaining to people i was born here. Watching my muslim neighbours house being raided by the anti-terrorist squad and then being told it's a routine police inquiry. Getting all your job applications thrown into the bin despite having a 2.2 degree and watching your white class mates getting 25k jobs despite having a 3rd grade pass.

Watching the BBC and ITV news about another country which is being invaded by the u.s and u.k in the name of freedom and democracy.

Being asked by little scruffy girls while going to the corner fish and chip shop do I want some business..
Being stopped at airports and asked stupid questions..
well just a few thing that makes me proud to be british

[MosDef]

lol brother walid - i have to agree regarding jobs. Why do Muslims find it so hard to get jobs?

Well il answer my own question: :)

BBC Five Live survey suggests ethnic minority applicants still discriminated against in UK job market. Racial discrimination is still a widespread experience for job applicants, a study by BBC Radio Five Live suggests.

Five Live mounted an undercover survey lasting ten months in which dummy CVs were sent out to a wide range of companies in response to recruitment advertisements.

For each vacancy, six applications were sent - one male and one female from each of three groups: White European, Asian Muslim and Black African. Fifty companies looking for employees in a variety of fields were selected at random from newspaper situations vacant columns and recruitment websites.

Five Live produced CVs for six fictional candidates – Abu Olasemi, Fatima Khan, Jenny Hughes, John Andrews, Nasser Hanif and Yinka Olatande.

All the fictitious applicants were the same standard in terms of qualifications and experience but were written and presented differently to increase their authenticity to recruiters. But while 23 per cent of the white candidates' applications were invited for interview, only 13 and 9 per cent respectively were successful from the Black African and Muslim candidates.

Background & methodology

The research was inspired by a story covered on Five Live's Up All Night programme which examined American research suggesting candidates with traditionally 'white' names received interview offers twice as often as those with traditionally 'black' names.

Five Live adapted the study to find out what the situation was in the UK, also introducing an Islamic dimension. Fifty advertisements from newspapers and recruitment websites were selected with each company sent six CVs - two with Muslim names, two with Black African names and two with White European names.

Each advertisement was responded to with one male and one female applicant.

The station sought advice from personnel experts on what employers look for in CVs and covering letters, and ensured consistent standards in all the applications. Additionally a wide range of careers, levels of seniority and geographical locations were chosen to try to present a national picture. Candidates invited for interview did not attend.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2004/07_july/12/minorities_survey.shtml


My own personal experiences have been similar to yours - cannot even get a interview. The only jobs i had in the past came via muslim employers - alhamdulillah. Why cant the MCB or MPAC do this kind of survey? Is it because the results would unleash a can of worms they cannot afford? I believe this BBC survey has been watered down and didnt get much exposure. We dont want the muslim youth thinking they are being conned now do we!?

[abu~Adil as somali]

bill letter, another bill letter, red letter, another red letter, oops baill ppl comin to the house...i better pay that bill



noooo, road tax runnin out again..i could of swore i got the last one few months bk...ahwell..am sure i could drive round couple of more weeks without it...

[umm hasan]

Brother walid is right, but you can say the same about some muslim countries where these kind of things go on. The western countries have had law, order and human rights only in the last 80-100 years. The difference lies between the governments and the people. Slowly with time the people will have as much hate for Islam as their leaders, but out of ignorance rather than choice.

I guess a time will come when these laws won't be applied to muslims living in the west, which is the case for some muslims already, but at the moment it seems like everything is fine and dandy.

[Umm Ahmed]

Being asked by little scruffy girls while going to the corner fish and chip shop do I want some business..


You must live in a bad area akhee.

[walid]

salaam dear sisters,
1st the u.k has changed in the last 30 years and for many it's really bad, believe me I personally know dozens of cases of abuse and harassment by the establishment and things will get worse although not all people are bad.
2nd I don't live in a bad area, actually whenever, I go to town I get these girls approaching me in the day!!!..All my life i've always avoided girls but for some reason they aproach me. Once in town I just ignorned them but they got very angry because i didn't even acknowledge them, they started swearing and even followed me because i wouldn't talk.

Thats the truth sis of course this sort of thing happens everywhere but u.k is not a poor country and there are oppertunities for all, they just have to make an effort.

[Umm Ahmed]

The girls are a test for you , and the way of non muslim women is to go after the unattainable, may Allaah protect you ameen.

[walid]

jazakAllah khair sister umm

[MosDef]

http://www.economist.com/images/20070901/CIR882.gif

August 2007

http://www.economist.com/world/international/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9725332

[Abu Malik al-Maliki]

I only read the first post and my first thought is "What's wrong with football?"

[Abu Malik al-Maliki]

When I went to London a few weeks ago, I would get scared whenever I saw a bearded Asian with a rucksack on the Underground because I feared he might be a suicide bomber. It is Al-Qaeda who are to blame for this btw.

Stats are shocking btw, Mos Def. It doesn't take two brain cells to work out only 0.1% of Muslims are suicide bombers, but I am sad by the higher number of British Muslims who felt 7/7 was justified

[Skillganon]

salaam dear sisters,
1st the u.k has changed in the last 30 years and for many it's really bad, believe me I personally know dozens of cases of abuse and harassment by the establishment and things will get worse although not all people are bad.
2nd I don't live in a bad area, actually whenever, I go to town I get these girls approaching me in the day!!!..All my life i've always avoided girls but for some reason they aproach me. Once in town I just ignorned them but they got very angry because i didn't even acknowledge them, they started swearing and even followed me because i wouldn't talk.

Thats the truth sis of course this sort of thing happens everywhere but u.k is not a poor country and there are oppertunities for all, they just have to make an effort.

Well next time one approach you propose to them. :D

[Hisn al-Muslim]

I know it's off-topic but important to mention: The asl (origin) of any action out of ibaadah, is that it's allowed or permissible unless there is a textual proof to say otherwise.

- HM

[hussain]

i dont think there is anything intrinsic to british culture that is admirable.

I agree.


the only thing admirable about the kuffar way of life is how they r a people who adhere to rules and systems and therefore have progressed technologically and industrially far above the other nations.

I don't think this is admirable - just look at the cost of their progress.

Let's start with colonial exploitation; continue with usury (and the capitalism that goes with it); and exploitation of the Earth (with the consequences we're now seeing like global warming and the problems that'll bring to the non western world).

Let's also not forget how many millions of people they've killed in their wars and colonial conquests.

Are their societies really admirable? What have they done with all their so called progress? Why only today I heard on the radio (yes some of us do still listen to such things!) that at least one young person per week dies in England from sniffing glue and the like. How many die from drug abuse? Alcohol abuse? We could go on (and on...).

[hussain]

We could go on (and on...).

Like -

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/uk_news/england/tees/7063366.stm

"Former soldier" as well - of the likes we see imposing their values on our brothers and sisters in Iraq and Afghanistan.

[Abuz Zubair]

hussain, is there any good in British culture, at all?

[abu_ibrahim]

hussain, is there any good in British culture, at all?

Yes, £1.99 Chicken meals are lovely, can't find them anywhere else.

[abu_ibrahim]

When I went to London a few weeks ago, I would get scared whenever I saw a bearded Asian with a rucksack on the Underground because I feared he might be a suicide bomber. It is Al-Qaeda who are to blame for this btw.

What a coward lol. Did you soil yourself Mr Shia?

[hussain]

hussain, is there any good in British culture, at all?

well, I quite like a game of cricket....

But that's not really culture now, is it?

[Hamza]

Yes, £1.99 Chicken meals are lovely, can't find them anywhere else.

The problem is that there aint much chicken in those meals bro :)

[Abuz Zubair]

well, I quite like a game of cricket....

But that's not really culture now, is it?
Cricket is the only good thing you can think of? everything else in British culture is bad?

[WM]

What about the language itself?

[Umm]

What a coward lol.

That has to be the post of the year on IA.

[Umm]

An aspect of British culture that I [and I think most brit-born sisters] adhere religiously to: holding a small child's hand when walking down the road. I was appalled when an Algerian sister whose son [a toddler] was running all over the pavement [sidewalk] of a busy main road, and coming very close to the kerb. I've noticed this with every sister who was not born here, they all let their kids do this.

[WM]

An aspect of British culture

- not something exclusively British by any stretch of the imagination.

[Niqaabis]

An aspect of British culture that I [and I think most brit-born sisters] adhere religiously to: holding a small child's hand when walking down the road. I was appalled when an Algerian sister whose son [a toddler] was running all over the pavement [sidewalk] of a busy main road, and coming very close to the kerb. I've noticed this with every sister who was not born here, they all let their kids do this.

I saw this once too, I was stuck in slow moving traffic and there were these 2 woman, they weren't wearing hijaab but I could tell they were foreign. One was pushing a push chair whilst talking to her friend. Her toddler son was slowly walking behind, the mother didnt even notice, then when she reached about halfway down the long road, I heard her shout "Abdullaah Yalla"

I was like subhaan Allaah what kind of mother just walks away from her child down a busy road, if it wasnt for the slow moving traffic, I dont know what would have happend to the boy

[Abu Abdur-Rahman]

queing, from exeperience travelling to different parts of the muslim lands i have found that either they dont know how to do it properly or that they've never heard of it e.g on hajj, even whilst doing the most simple things like waiting for zamzam queing seems to be something strange to them.

[abumuwahid]

hussain, is there any good in British culture, at all?

Chicken Tika Masala is great (without the beer, of course.)

Chicken tikka masala (Hindi: चिकन टिक्का मसाला; Punjabi: ਚਿਕਨ ਟਿੱਕਾ ਮਸਾਲਾ; Bengali: চিকেন টিক্কা মাসালা) is a South Asian dish based on Indian-style roast chicken chunks (chicken tikka) in a tomato, curry sauce. The cross-cultural popularity of the dish in the United Kingdom led former Labour foreign secretary Robin Cook to proclaim it as "Britain's true national dish".[1] Indian dishes such as Murgh Makhani or Butter Chicken are similar in preparation and taste to Chicken tikka masala. In Pakistan, it is also known as Chicken Masala[2] or Tandoori

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/44/Chicken_Tikka_Masala_KellySue.JPG/684px-Chicken_Tikka_Masala_KellySue.JPG

[Brother_Mujahid]

- Moaning about Monday mornings
- Talking about the weather
- Using 'Sorry' as a prefix to a question
- Apologising when someone bumps into you!

Wow, the apple really doesn't fall far from the tree. We Yanks do all of the above mentioned activities.

[Abu Abdallah al-Bulghari]

saying please and thankyou

No.

[waziri]

No.

No thankyou

[nomad]

No thankyou

No.

You aint british, its a british thing, gotta say please and thank you. If you aint heard it you aint mixing with very nice people.

Please can i have that pen?

Can i have that pen, please.

It even matters where you say it in the sentance.

Thankyou, ta, cheers, thanks, all means the same.

Other cultures words for please have fallen into misuse.

[Abuz Zubair]

You aint british, its a british thing, gotta say please and thank you. If you aint heard it you aint mixing with very nice people.

Please can i have that pen?

Can i have that pen, please.

It even matters where you say it in the sentance.

Thankyou, ta, cheers, thanks, all means the same.

Other cultures words for please have fallen into misuse.
It's funny you say that because in the Arab world, the equivalent for 'please', i.e. 'min fadlik' is not to be found beyond books!

[Magoo]

It's funny you say that because in the Arab world, the equivalent for 'please', i.e. 'min fadlik' is not to be found beyond books!

one of the few phrases i know in arabic and when i use it with arabs they give me a funny look, this explains why! :o

[Abu Abdallah al-Bulghari]

No thankyou


Are you saying that British Muslims prefer "thank you" to "JAK"?

[Umm]

Also, not parking in the middle of a main road and halting all the traffic just to pick your kid up from the madrasah on the corner.

[Abu Bakr as-Somali]

I saw this once too, I was stuck in slow moving traffic and there were these 2 woman, they weren't wearing hijaab but I could tell they were foreign. One was pushing a push chair whilst talking to her friend. Her toddler son was slowly walking behind, the mother didnt even notice, then when she reached about halfway down the long road, I heard her shout "Abdullaah Yalla"

I was like subhaan Allaah what kind of mother just walks away from her child down a busy road, if it wasnt for the slow moving traffic, I dont know what would have happend to the boy


LOl they are being raised like Proppa MEN

It's funny you say that because in the Arab world, the equivalent for 'please', i.e. 'min fadlik' is not to be found beyond books!


Min fadhlik isnt used, we usually say : law sama7t [meaning somtin like if you allow lol]
or
ba3d iznak {after your permission}

[Abu Abdallah al-Bulghari]

This is a sneaky defeatist thread promoting Westernization.

[Abuz Zubair]

This is a sneaky defeatist thread promoting Westernization.
What kind of stupid comment is that to make? Are you denying that there is any good in Western cultures? What is wrong with appreciating some of the good qualities we may have inherited by living in the West?

Have you ever lived in a Muslim country? Especially the middle east or Indian subcontinent? Or have you lived all your life in the West you find 100% ugly?

[ummafnaan]

Assalamu alaikum Akhi Abu Abdullah Al Bulghari,

Lighten up akhi. You are too serious and its like you never see the good in anything. Just my opinion anyway.

[Abu Bakr as-Somali]

ih ave lived most my life in the islamic world hence the bad typng, but there is a lot of good in the west, like ppl are polite, treat you with respect even though they are higher in command, or stronger. Unlike here where they literally slap you around. If u see police over there you feel safe, [ya3ni someone wont rob you atleast] but over her, u'll go like "OMG I'm gonna get slapped again"

lol

[Abuz Zubair]

Assalamu alaikum Akhi Abu Abdullah Al Bulghari,

Lighten up akhi. You are too serious and its like you never see the good in anything. Just my opinion anyway.
Thank you for pointing this out. I have informed the brother about the same observation I had but I don't think he took it well. He does seem to have a lot of built up anger for some reason.