Does God hate these people?

Discussion in 'Islamic Theology and Ideology' started by Iman_Hammad, Jun 16, 2012.

  1. Iman_Hammad

    Iman_Hammad New Member

    Hi I wanted to talk about something that has been a big impediment for me in worshipping Allah properly. Why are good Muslims suffering so much? I don't mean your sheikh who comes to these big confrences and has a name for himself. I am talking about average Muslims you meet and know everyday. I know people who are good righteous Muslims. Don't hurt others, make extra worship to God, pray and make du'aa all the time, remind others of God, you wish the world was full of such Muslims but they have problems one on top of another. All that du'aa they make for ease never happens. Look at Gitmo, Babar Ahmad etc. Why are these people suffering? I know a man who lost his wife and child in labout. His wife got pregnant after 11 years and he was so happy. They both died after 11 yeara of heartache and hardship he thought God was giving him ease but instead a bigger museebah struck him.

    I really find this hard to understand. I thought after hardship comes ease. Are these people sinners? Does God hate them? This brother gets back bityen by people they say he is cursed because of all the hardahip he has faced.

    This really affects me ever since I can remember amd it puts me off worship amd gives me bad thoughts about God. Wallaahi I want to get iver this. How do I? No one evrr answers these questions it's like everyone wants to give da'wah to the non muslima but what about us Muslims who need help woth our imaan. Maybe I am not a Muslim really as I have these bad thoughts and don't worship God properly. Sometimes I think that too.
  2. Mu'awiya

    Mu'awiya New Member

    asalaamu alaykum (peace be upon you)

    Do the people think that they will be left to say, "We believe" and they will not be tested?

    But We have certainly tested those before them, and Allah will surely make evident those who are truthful, and He will surely make evident the liars.

    Or do those who do evil deeds think they can outrun Us? Evil is what they judge.

    (Quran -
    Surah Ankabut [the spider] 29: 2-4)

    And among mankind is he who worships Allah as it were, upon the very edge (i.e. in doubt); if good befalls him, he is content therewith; but if a trial befalls him, he turns back on his face (i.e. reverts back to disbelief after embracing Islam). He loses both this world and the Hereafter. That is the evident loss.

    (Quran surah Hajj 22:11)

    Allah burdens not a person beyond his scope (Quran - 2:286)

    A person is tested by good and evil, will he remain loyal to Allah through all times in life?

    The successful one is the one who thinks good of Allah, knowing that Allah knows everything, and He is doing good for His slave, even if the slave himself cannot understand the wisdom behind the test.

    Allah doesn't burden a person beyond their scope, so you will never face any difficulty in this world except that Allah has given you the ability to stay patient with it. That's how powerful that Allah has made the person. It is then for the person to fulfill that high level responsibility of remaining patient and thankful during hardships and ease.

    Paradise is surrounded by hardships, and Hell is surrounded by desires.
    This is why the best of people are tested the most, like the Prophets, then those after them of the best of the believers. Even though they face the most hardest difficulties, they are the happiest people in the world, because they have good hopes in Allah.

    We need to strive to become like them, to be the best of the best.

    ..It may be that you dislike a thing which is good for you and that you like a thing which is bad for you. Allah knows but you do not know.

    (Quran 2:216)

    Last edited: Jun 16, 2012
  3. Iman_Hammad

    Iman_Hammad New Member

    Also when I phone an imaam or someone in the mosque to talk about this I get shuffled along. That just feeds into my view that du'aat, scholars, imaams and what have you are useless and only help others when they can get some kudos in the public arena.
  4. Iman_Hammad

    Iman_Hammad New Member

    Thanks for your reply appreciate it. What about the fact after hardship comes ease? Why don't people get ease then when they pray and pray and pray endlessly for it. If the scholars are beloved to God then why don't they suffer like your everage Muslim. So many have it comfortable in thia world but your average Muslim like the Gitmo brothers are siffering severely. What if someone suffrred so severely and it tested his imaan and he started wavering how is that his fault? God shouldn't have decreed something so tremendous on him.
  5. Iman_Hammad

    Iman_Hammad New Member

    It's easy to say God loves him that's why he is tested so much. So doea God love the African Christians who are dying from hunger and starvation? Will they get into jannah? What kind of life do they have? They suffer in this world and then have hell fire to look forward to. I don't understand wallaahi I wish I had imaan like a strong Muslim.
  6. Mu'awiya

    Mu'awiya New Member

    asalaamu alaykum wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakaatuh

    The scholars or imams you talk about might not have strong faith compared to the brothers in prison. This is quite well known if we look at Islam's new generation compared to the previous generation.

    Now imagine someones imaan being like stairs. The higher you climb the stairs of imaan, the more steps you have to walk down to lose your imaan.

    So for someone of a high level of imaan to be tested severely shows that he has strong imaan that he can face the difficulty with ease. Yet if he chooses to doubt his reliance on Allah, he will lose imaan (go down a few steps.) If he persists in denying Allah, he will go down more stairs. Yet if he works on trying to better his relationship with Allah, he will climb to the higher steps again (compared to someone else whose weaker in belief.)

    So him having doubts in imaan after having certainty of imaan beforehand is his own fault, His high levels of imaan should prevent him from repeatedly wavering in imaan to the extent that he gives it up in its entirety.

    It's like a man whose earned $1million dollars. He's going to have more time to 'lose' the cash [lose the faith] he's earned compared to a man who only earned $1000. This shows the importance of continuously 'collecting' higher imaan through understanding knowledge and good action.
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2012
  7. Mu'awiya

    Mu'awiya New Member

    asalaamu alaykum wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakaatuh

    Keep asking.

    Whatever a person strives for, that is what they will get. A person who knows that Allah is their Creator and Provider, and chooses to worship and thank a stone idol, or a cross, or even their own desires (atheism) - why should Allah reward them on Judgment Day?

    If you serve God (Allah) alone, He promises you His Paradise. Why do you serve Him alone? Because He's the One who created you, and provides for you. Do you think Allah then needs to reward someone with Paradise, if that person thanked a stone idol, human or cross instead of Allah?

    Rather, Allah will reward a person with what they strived for. The believers strived for seeking Allah, His Pleasure and Paradise. So He will reward them with that.

    The non muslims preferred this world, thanked other beings instead of their own Provider, so they will only get the reward of this world. To be fair, Allah will even tell the non muslims to get the reward off the thing they sought besides Allah. So if someone thanked an idol, or Jesus and hoped that Jesus will reward them on Judgment Day - then Jesus himself will say that I am not your creator or your provider (rather he himself depends on God), you should have thanked your Creator and Provider and He would reward you with Paradise. So on this Day, only those who hoped reward from Allah will get their reward from Him. Anything else worshipped will not be able to give reward to the creation, so that person will be bankrupt, not be given anything except punishment due to their ungratefulness to their Creator.

    About the African kids who are Christians, did you know that many are wealthy while the Muslims of Africa are poor? The christian missionaries promise them money if they be Christians, which proves that they do get the reward in this life. Yet the reward is Paradise for the patient believers.

    So ALL non muslims get rewarded in this life according to the good they've done. Like Mother Theresa or Ghandi were given massive global fame, maybe they wanted their names to be remembered after death? So it happened. Whereas with the Muslims, Allah gives them reward both in this life and the next, because He is pleased with their gratefulness to Him.
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2012
  8. Salih Al-Bosni

    Salih Al-Bosni Abu sho?

    26:205-207 ; Seest thou? If We do let them enjoy (this life) for a few years, Yet there comes to them at length the (Punishment) which they were promised! It will profit them not that they enjoyed (this life)!

    And vice versa. Have you heard of the one to enter the paradise last? Have you heard of his reward? Also I do remember a hadith in which on the day of the resurrection, the one who enjoyed life the most will be dipped into the fire and asked if he has ever experienced any good and he will say no, never. And the one who has had it the worst will be dipped into the paradise and asked if he has experienced any misery and he will say no,never. However I am not sure of the authenticity of this hadith, I can't remember the source, and if anyone knows better please do correct.

    So sister ease does happen after hardship, and on that great day is the full recompense, weather good or bad. And there is a wisdom behind everything even if we do not understand it. Just recently(few months ago) my family's vehicle had gotten into an accident and was totalled completely from the back (rear ended). One might say this is bad, why does god hate me. But see, previously my brother had a dentist bill to pay, and my parents couldn't afford to pay off the debt that quickly, so this company decided to get a court order to seize the car and sell it for half of what its worth and claim the monies. Now that the car was totalled they couldn't take it... and because it was totalled, the insurance company wrote off the car for how much it was worth(give or take some small amount). And so everything was fine. And by this we can see that had it not happened, there would be a greater loss. We cannot even comprehend the ways of Allah ta ala.

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  9. student of Knowledge

    student of Knowledge AZ fan club!

    Salaam sister,

    May Allah increase your iman. I had similar things to work through a some years ago. It's partly because we were never taught about how to digest and appreciate these aspects of Islam.

    1. Firstly I would say that yes Allah subhaana wa ta'ala speaks about ease after hardship but for each person that can amount to something different. Only when you take different aspects of the deen together does this point become straightforward. In one hadith, the prophet mentioned that one hand span of paradise will literally make the person who receives it forget all the hardship they ever experienced in this world! In mathematics, this is like comparing infinity to the finite - finite things become equal to zero when compared to infinity. For other people, there ease - i.e. the response to their dua - comes in this world. Initially, you might think this is better, but one alim mentioned how the sahaba would weep when receiving dunyawi worldly blessings - they feared that Allah had not accepted their good deeds at the level of rewarding them in the next life, but their good deeds were only worthy of being rewarded here!

    2. As for the suffering of non-Muslims in ethiopia and the like, all I would say is that Allah has not given us the knowledge or right to determine the account of those people, even if the law determines them as disbelievers in this world. What counts a a valid excuse for non-Muslims before Allah is not something that we can determine absolutely in actual cases. If a person is starving, this might actually lift taklif from that person because responsibility for accepting the message is dependent on being able to receive it.

    The issue of receiving worldly relief needs to be given deeper reflection. Consider sumayyah radiallaahu anha, the first shahida of Islam who was tortured and killed. She was martyred before any worldly ease or victory came to the Muslims. Yet, this did not negate the fact that for her their is ease after that suffering.
  10. Umm Sayyid Qutb

    Umm Sayyid Qutb تعس عبد الدينار

    Thats actually a very good question, and i think most of us have thought about this.

    The thing is Allah is just and will never do injustice to anyone, and Allah is also Most-wise, now if you combine these two, Just and Wise you realize that its in the Wisdom of Allah that anyone would go through pain in any shape or form. And dont you think that there is a reason why people are dying of hunger and starvation in Africa when clearly there's plenty of resources in their country? The reason is because of the dhulm committed by the west against the "third world", and since Allah is just, on the day of djugement, He will djuge between them, and each one will have his/her right.

    Also remember the reason why we are in this world to begin with:

    "Be sure We shall test you with something of fear and hunger, some loss in goods, lives and the fruits (of your toil), but give glad tidings to those who patiently persevere. Who say: when afflicted with calamity: "To Allah we belong and to Him is our return." [2:155-156]

    and also reflect upon this vers: "Recall that your Lord summoned all the descendants of Adam, and had them bear witness for themselves: "Am I not your Lord?" They all said, "Yes. We bear witness." Thus, you cannot say on the Day of Resurrection, "We were not aware of this." [7:172]
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  11. خالد

    خالد New Member

    Who says they don't? Read this thread for one:

    Insha'Allah see these threads:

    If they were presented Islaam and then rejected it, they won't go to heaven. One who prefers Shirk over Tawhid, does not deserve Jannah. It doesn't matter whether this person is the poorest person in the world or the richest. People won't be excused because of their poverty in the Dunya. They are four types of people who will (validly) protest on Day of Judgement. Insha'Allah read the hadith:

    "There are four (who will protest) to Allaah on the Day of Resurrection: the deaf man who never heard anything, the insane man, the very old man, and the man who died during the fatrah (the interval between the time of ‘Eesaa (Jesus, upon whom be peace) and the time of Muhammad SAWS (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)). The deaf man will say, ‘O Lord, Islam came but I never heard anything.’ The insane man will say, ‘O Lord, Islam came but the children ran after me and threw stones at me.’ The very old man will say, ‘O Lord, Islam came but I did not understand anything.’ The man who died during the fatrah will say, ‘O Lord, no Messenger from You came to me.’ He will accept their promises of obedience, then word will be sent to them to enter the Fire. By the One in Whose hand is the soul of Muhammad, if they enter it, it will be cool and safe for them." Source
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  12. Mu'awiya

    Mu'awiya New Member

    asalaamu alaykum wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakaatuh

    I forgot to answer this question.

    People face different levels of ease after difficulty. Some people get a way out from the hardship through being released physically from the hardship.

    Others get emotional and spiritual release from the hardship. For example, a strong Muslim who has been tortured severely in prison may not be released from the prison, but he has got a break from the torture and has spent his 'free time' in du'a or prayer which gives him calmness, happiness, and ease - unmatched by even people of the 'free world.'

    Now you might wonder why the best of people get tortured. The answer is simple; People on Judgment will be payed back in accordance with the good or evil they did. If you do good, you'll be rewarded with good. If you do evil, your good will be rewarded to the one you did wrong too. So the best of people who face hardship from others will get the evil persons good deeds which he couldn't have got otherwise.

    This hadith explains it well;

    In al-Tirmidhi it is narrated in a marfoo’ report: “On the Day of Resurrection people will wish that their skins had been cut with scissors in this world, when they see the reward of those who were struck with calamity.” One of the salaf said: Were it not for the calamities of this world, we would come empty-handed on the Day of Resurrection.

    Islam Question and Answer - The believer’s attitude towards calamities

    Allah knows best.
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  13. Scented Blood

    Scented Blood Abu Peanut

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  14. ElementIslam

    ElementIslam New Member

    What about the Prophet Muhammed (peace be upon him) he had the hardest test than all of us yet Allah loved him more, when Allah loves you more he tests you more as strange as it sounds. with these tests you are raised in rank in jannah and forgiven of sins. Some people Allah puts a problem in their life so they turn to him, example if you have everything, big mansion, fast car etc etc and life was perfect then that person may forget Allah however when there is a difficulty some people read salah just because of it, Allah loves when we turn to him, sometimes we need that little problem to turn to him
  15. Scented Blood

    Scented Blood Abu Peanut

    I was listening to a lecture last night where Sheik Yawar Baig was talking about the companions and how when they were given their rightful share of the wealth from the state they would refuse to take it saying that they did not want it in this life if it meant that it would decrease their reward in the next life.

    A reminder to us all that these people understood ease to come with the removal of their souls from thier bodies and that they would have rather suffer a lifetime of pain happily and seek thier reward with Allah than enjoy the good of this life even if it was halal for them.
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2012
  16. Wild Wild West

    Wild Wild West لا تعتذر اليوم


    I used to have these kinds of thoughts too, until someone advise me to:

    1 - Know that we could never know about individual peoples circumstances if they are in a general group - like these African Christians. We know that Allah is merciful and kind, and in the end it is He who will judge everyone and He and only He will decide where we end up. Part of tawakkul (trust in Allah) is to leave this to Him and to be happy that it is He who will decide.

    In the end, whoever goes to Hell will only go because he/she deserved to, and whoever goes to paradise will only go because of Allahs mercy - and even those who end up in Hell will say 'alhamdu lillaahi rabbil 'aalameen (all praise is for the Lord of the Worlds) as they go, because pefect justice would have been done on that day.

    2 - I advise you, as others have said, to read about the lives of the righteous and how they suffered. You will immediately see that Allah gave them relief even as they were suffering in terms of peace and tranquility - something that all the monet in the world cannot buy. I advise you to read 'return of the pharoah by Zainab Ghazzali as an example of this. I know there was an online pdf copy of this somewhere.

    Inshallah by careful study and reflection you will see that the promise of Allah is very true - and it is embodied in the lives of the righteous.
  17. Wild Wild West

    Wild Wild West لا تعتذر اليوم

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  18. Umm DJ-N

    Umm DJ-N Patience

    We need to remember that we don't have a "give and take" relationship with Allah, for some muslims may Allah forgive them and us, when a calamity strikes they list alll the ibadah they have done and ask "why me? Why not her who doesn't give charity, or why not that family whose children are so and so".etc etc

    This is not how it works, the closer you are to Allah SWT does NOT mean your life should become easier. Don't forget, our worship does not benefit Allah SWT in the slightest.
  19. Abu 3baydah

    Abu 3baydah New Member

  20. Mu'awiya

    Mu'awiya New Member

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