Good Answer??

Discussion in 'Islamic Theology and Ideology' started by Die for Allah, May 4, 2007.

  1. Die for Allah

    Die for Allah TIOCFAIDH AR LA


    I would like to kow what akhi Abu Zubair and other knowledgeable forum members think of the answer given to the question below.

    It seems quite balanced to me,the mufti seems to affirm the meaning of the sifat of knowledge and it seems he is also saying that the meaning of the other siffat of Allah (subhana wa ta ala)need to be affirmed, but when it comes to Allah descending he says the mana is not known.

    Your views please JazakAllah khair.


    The Ash`aris and Maturidis, who form what we refer to as Ahl al Sunnah, state regarding the mutashabihat, that both the ma`ana and kayf are unknown to us.

    In contrast to this the modern day Salafi sect, who find their roots with Shaykh Ibn Taymiyya and others, state that the ma`ana is known haqiqatan and only the kayf is unknown. Thus, they reject tafwidh and consider it the method of innovators, as Shaykh Ibn Uthaymin mentions in his works.

    Is saying that the ma`ana is thabit haqiqatan wa `ala dhahir not tajsim? Or a door to tajsim, which is against the way of Ahl al Sunnah and our Deobandi `ulema? Was Shaykh Ibn Taymiyyah’s `aqida in these regards against the Ahl al Sunnah, for example he would say “Allah istiwa `ala al arsh haqiqatan”. Some of
    the `ulema such as Imam Ibn Hajar Haytami, Imam Subki, and Imam Zahid al Kawthari were very opposed to many of the views of Shaykh Ibn Taymiyya and his `aqida. What is your view?


    The view of the majority is as you mention that such verses that speak of Allah taala becoming established on His throne and the hadith that states Allah descends to the lowest heaven are accepted as established. That is when Allah taala says, for example, that He “descends,” he does so but we do not know what this means in any way. Rather, such texts are from the Mutashabihat (knowledge of which is with Allah taala) and as such cannot be explained .
    Shaikh Ibn Taymiyyah went a little further, and whereas the majority refrained from stating what the literal meaning of (for example) descending means in relation to Allah taala, Shaikh Ibn Taymiyyah said that in fact it means Allah taala literally (Haqiqiatan) descends.

    This view would not however lead to Tajsim or Tashbih, because he also added this descending is not like the descending of the creation. This is similar to Allah ’s attribute of Knowledge; we establish this attribute or Allah taala, however humans also have knowledge. We do not say that we do not know what it means by Allah taala possessing knowledge. Rather we affirm His attribute of knowledge, knowing it is nothing like our limited knowledge.
    Similarly, Shaikh Ibn Taymiyyah would say, we should do regarding the other attributes of descending etc. in order to be closer to how Allah taala has described Himself.

    From this explanation one can see that he is not guilty of Tashbih or Tajsim. The story of him, during a speech he was giving, saying “Allah taala desends like this,” and then proceeding to descend off the Minbar are fabricated and baseless propaganda against him. Having said this, the view of the majority is still the safest.

    Wallahu Aalam bis-sawab

    Mufti Mohammed Sajjad
  2. Expergefactionist

    Expergefactionist hmmm... Staff Member

    Well, its good that he doesn't accuse IT of Tajsim or heresy, but he is wrong with respect to the majority view.

    He is espousing tafweedh of the literal meaning, while he has no qualms about attributing 'descent' to Allah, which is ironically the literal meaning of nuzul :) But then he contradicts himself saying: 'we don't say Allah literally descends'.

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