Important Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

Discussion in 'Family Life' started by Ibn Jafar, Mar 22, 2012.

  1. Ibn Jafar

    Ibn Jafar Well-Known Member

    Maryam Amir Ebrahimi wrote this article a while back for the Suhaib Webb site. It's basically a woman's take on this issue. I wonder, was Shaykh Haitham's article in response to this?

    Wifehood and Motherhood are Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Two earlier articles also touched on a similar theme; Hook Up with Allah, Allah will Hook You Up and Hook Up with the Quran, Allah Will Hook You Up.

    The opening of the first of these articles;

    What do the critics of Shaykh Haitham's articles think?
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2012
  2. Expergefactionist

    Expergefactionist hmmm... Staff Member

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    We think it takes two to tango
     
  3. Ibn Jafar

    Ibn Jafar Well-Known Member

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    But one must lead
     
    cBox, Abdullah11 and muslimah911 like this.
  4. muslimah911

    muslimah911 <A HREF="showthread.php?t=70991"></A>

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    It says in the Qur'an that when Allah and His Messenger decides an affair,that we have no say so in the matter.If Allah says he have made the husband the head of the family and the pious women are devoutly obedient to the husband,then that's what he meant.

    This is why the divorce rate is so high now because Muslims want to do whatever they want and not what Allah want.These type of 'Muslims' get on my nerves.They have chosen this dajaal society and trying to please it instead of choosing obedience to Allah.
     
    Abdullah11 likes this.
  5. Soul

    Soul Banned

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    scrambling a egg and boiling my brains....
    really?
     
  6. Abdullah11

    Abdullah11 A wannabe neologist

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Has anyone read this?

    [​IMG]
     
  7. re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    It all boils down to the wife being obedient to her amir

    I see it many a time sisters not going this., this is the root of the problem in society

    The sister that obeys her husband are the one that excel in being a wife, mother, daughter, daughter in law and helping in her community and so on

    That's what I call an empowered muslimah, first and up most her obedience to Allah this will shine through because of her obedience to her husband

    The men in society need to stop being lazy and being the breadwinner and the women should go back to being a wife and mother that uses her strenghth to help the ummah with the permission of her amir- there no sin upon her if she doesn't and more reward for being obedient to her husband.
     
    UmmTaymiyyah and muslimah911 like this.
  8. muslimah911

    muslimah911 <A HREF="showthread.php?t=70991"></A>

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Motherhood is the hardest job in the world.You ought to be ashamed of yourself.
     
  9. muslimah911

    muslimah911 <A HREF="showthread.php?t=70991"></A>

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    These so called liberated sisters don't want to hear that but they need to anyway.
     
  10. Wild Wild West

    Wild Wild West لا تعتذر اليوم

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Sh Haithams article is a million times better than this nonsense.
     
    Tuwaylib likes this.
  11. Ibn Jafar

    Ibn Jafar Well-Known Member

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    What do people expect? As soon as one says a woman is not "confined" to marriage and motherhood they open a Pandora's box.

    Quite simply I see a lot of brothers (so far its been the men who are championing this) pushing more and more responsibilities on the sisters, without anyone pointing out the obvious; where are the men?!

    Women are overly active in the Western Muslim community. From what I know most? of the work done for the prisoners, a matter more important than even Dawah, is by women.

    I suspect most of these women that have all this free time to offer the Ummah don't home-school their childern.

    If people were really interested in empowering and educating women we would see a massive effort aimed at instilling confidence in young mothers saying yes, you can educate your children better than the Queen or the Fed or whatever nonsense they have in Canada.

    If people were really interested in empowering women they would send time and effort teaching young girls that being a wife to a husband that satisfies you and a mother to children that love you is the most liberating thing you will ever experience as a woman.


    Instead we have folks with sketchy intentions trying to be the White Knight telling sisters what they want to hear.

    Men have been oppressing women for ages with their good intentions and misplaced chivalry, causing all types of damage to society by ideas that go against the grain of nature.

    And it's always the girls who are left holding the bill.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2012
  12. muslimah911

    muslimah911 <A HREF="showthread.php?t=70991"></A>

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Brother the Muslims have gotten so westernized and secular and materialistic thats its no longer what Allah says.Allah did not give all the responsibilities on the woman.That's nonsense for anyone to say that.Too many are just following whatever society dictates.And not what Allah dictates.Too many men have lost their manhood if they ever had any to start with.These days the real Muslim men are jihadists or in jail.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2012
  13. Jayyid Jiddan

    Jayyid Jiddan New Member

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    I have not read the article linked on this thread but I think your comment is partially incorrect. Yes, it seems to me also that much (but not all) of the work done for the prisoners is being performed by women. You are incorrect however when you say that home educators are not amongst them. To give you a more accurate picture of sisters involved in prisoner campaigns as well as other Islamic work:

    - the sister who founded SOLACE and is the driving force behind it is a homeschooler, as well as other shura members who were involved from the outset and keyworkers being homeschoolers

    - the two sisters who have been pivotal in the Aid Convoy 2 Syria, whose husbands are amongst the founders, are both homeschoolers, as are other sisters who have assisted them. One of these sisters travelled to the refugee camps in Turkey with her husband.

    - there are several sisters who are keyworkers for HHUGS or on their board who are homeschoolers

    - the sister who was responsible for Cageprisoners for more than 6 years was a homeschooler

    - the sister who currently updates the news and articles on Cageprisoners website is a homeschooler

    - the sister behind the Free Talha campaign is a homeschooler

    - Free Babar Ahmad is primarily run by his sisters who are both mothers with the support of another homeschooling mother. Other homeschooling mothers were actively involved in the petition campaign as well as a considerable number of very active single sisters.

    - the sister who founded and runs JFAC is a homeschooler

    - the sister who manages the virtual side of the Save Shaker Aamer Campaign is a homeschooler

    - Fatima Barkatulla was a homeschooler

    - Zohra Sarwari is a homeschooler

    - The IHSAN home education network and forum is run by homeschooling mothers

    - Naima B Robert an author, founder and Editor in Chief of Sisters' Magazine, is a homeschooler

    - Umm Reem, who founded Daughters of Adam, writes for Muslim Matters and is active in her community as well as raising two of her children as huffadh, is a homeschooler

    - Umm Talha, from Masjid Ansar and Shajarah Tayyibah, is a homeschooler

    - Sadaf Farooqi , writer and activist, is a homeschooler

    - Hena Zuberi, Editor of Muslim Matters, is a homeschooler

    - the sister coordinating the sisters side of MRDF is a homeschooler

    And the list goes on.

    Free Detainees is run by sisters and to the best of my knowledge they are not married so whether they homeschool or not is inapplicable. The same can be said of other campaigns where sisters have been heavily involved like the Free Tarek Mehanna campaign, al-Istiqamah and Global Voice for Justice again primarily sisters. Sisters are involved in Aseerun and the virtual side of the Guantanamo Justice Centre is again administered by a sister and mother.

    I think the above is worth reflecting on, considering that home educators are
    a) in the minority amongst sisters generally
    b) it's a choice which required a lot of thought about the welfare of their children and putting that above anything else in their lives, and involved considerable sacrifice, time, effort, sabr, often facing criticism from the Muslim community or even family members, moreso than it takes to be a parent of those children who are in school for the best part of the day.

    Some of the cases where sisters are active may be instances where men have failed to step up in their obligations to the ummah and so it has fallen on sisters, as both yourself and brother Tuwaylib mentioned on the other thread.

    However some of this work will be areas where the input of sisters is extremely important if not vital, that necessitates that they are the primary forces involved. For example, SOLACE and HHUGS dealing with primarily female beneficiaries and therefore primarily a female workforce; IHSAN also due to the fact that in the vast majority of families the primary educator will be the mother; Sisters Magazine being a publication that is aimed at Muslim women, so it is only natural that the editor, contributors are largely female as they will have insight into those issues; sisters playing a pivotal role in da'wah who are speaking on behalf of Muslim women in the media. With the Aid Convoy, sisters have been able to be the contact point for fundraising and aid donations, speaking at sisters only events, sorting aid with other sisters, drop off points for other sisters, which significantly reduces or even eliminates ikhtilaat, responsible for emails, the website, Facebook which then allows their husbands and mahrams to focus on roles which are less appropriate for the sisters - like being on the convoy itself etc. The same thing occurred with the Gaza Convoy. Even in the human rights and charity sector, many of those involved are non-Muslim women so it would be more appropriate and less fitnah if a sister liaised with them instead of brothers. There are a number of Muslim schools which the community benefits from which were founded and are driven by Muslim mothers, serving as head teachers etc, and in some cases the majority of their staff will be female. How would it work in terms of practicalities, bearing in mind ikhtilaat and potential fitnah, if brothers were to take on all these roles where they would be interacting closely with non mahram women?

    The other point is that sisters may be contributing to fields where brothers are already active but where they have knowledge, skills, or expertise that can benefit the ummah in general - does this mean that these sisters should therefore step back and leave these areas to the brothers as I think had been suggested earlier on this forum? Was it the case that the Sahabiyaat withheld from narrating ahadith because there were plenty of men amongst the Sahaba to fulfil this role, or contrary to that, that their contribution to this was significant? Was it that women taught, even when their students were other men, even teaching in the Prophet's mosque, despite the fact that there was no shortage of male scholars and teachers to perform this role?

    If we were to apply that argument should someone like sister Fajr, for example, close her blog, because I am quite sure that there are many brothers with a similar level of Arabic, if not even of a higher level, some of whom will also blog. Is it not the case that the sister's blog is very popular masha'Allah and beneficial, to people of both genders? Arabic Gems is another example of a such a blog run by a sister that was extremely popular and beneficial to both brothers and sisters. Should sister Yasmin Mogahed stop writing simply because there are a plethora of male da'ees and writers? Or is there not something in her writing that is very profound and deep, and her words touch the heart and effects the soul in a way I have not found in many male da'ees in our time who may surpass her in knowledge? The same could be said with sisters in other projects whom Allah has blessed with knowledge, creativity and skills that they can benefit the ummah with.

    We know that the Prophet (saw) said that "People are just like camels, out of 100 camels, one can hardly find a suitable camel to ride." That is true of both men and women - and that's why we find it tends to be the same people, irrespective of gender, who feel obliged to become active and involved, and why those people tend to feel overburdened and burnt out. How would it work if we remove the sisters from that equation? Do we have sufficient resources amongst brothers to replace them? Is it even appropriate to do so, in the areas mentioned above where they would primarily be dealing with women? Is it the case that women are able to do certain tasks because the majority of their time is not spent working outside the home as is the case with brothers? Is it the case that sisters doing such work from home often, or online, "frees up" their husbands and brothers to do other work for the sake of Allah that is less appropriate for the sisters and/or not obligatory upon them in the first place?

    NB: I should not have to repeat this ad nauseum but as a disclaimer, none of what I have written above detracts from the fact that I believe and have repeatedly stated that the priority for a women, if she is married and has children, is that of a wife and mother, and that any other activities she is involved in should not cause her to lose sight of or fall short in this primary role.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2012
  14. Expergefactionist

    Expergefactionist hmmm... Staff Member

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    I think the sisters who are leading these projects must be high achievers, and hence, they are never content with average.

    Sisters with less capacity, who often do not get involved in such social projects, let alone lead them, often cannot homeschool their children either, not that it is a fault in them, but because homeschooling is a difficult thing, and not everyone can achieve it.

    So the argument that a sister can either do one thing or the other is flawed, because a driven sister would want, and be able, to do it all. Not so driven sister may not have the drive to do as much socially or even at home. Allahu Alam.
     
  15. Wild Wild West

    Wild Wild West لا تعتذر اليوم

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Please, let us not generalise and have another thirty pager.
     
    maaqib likes this.
  16. Umm Waraqa Bluebell

    Umm Waraqa Bluebell kalimat al-ikhlaas

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Jayyid jiddan indeed :)

    Jazakillah khayran for another wonderfully epic, insightful post.
     
    Wild Wild West and Scented Blood like this.
  17. Soul

    Soul Banned

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    majnoon women should not be allowed to get married that only adds more diffculties to there lives....
     
  18. Al Jazairi

    Al Jazairi نناديكم و لكن من يجيب؟

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Don't say such things, especially not when you intend to speak about your situation.

    Just for your knowledge, only sane people even if they have mental/psychological issues are able to see their problems, and they tend to accuse themselves with lunacy, while a real insane man would never admit even that he has any minor issues, and they get so offended to be told they need therapy, this is just to let you know insha'a ALLAH you're not Majnoonah at all Alhamdo Lilah.

    And trust me, if it's not decreed for you to take care of your kids, then you won't no matter what state you are at, I've observed many cases in the family and the people I know, one case was because of her carrier she put her 2 kids at her mother's, and she left them for her mom to raise them.

    Another case, our neighbor is taking care of her daughter's son, whom her daughter's living 1200Km away from here for the sake of her career as well, and she left her kid here when he was 2 months old with the consent of her husband, who happens to work with her, and my mother told me, that when she comes in the 'Eid, her own son calls her Auntie, and calls his grandma Mom, and calls his uncle Dad, and calls his Dad uncle, and he's now 4 years old Masha'a ALLAH, and he comes to our house to play from to time, and I was really contemplating in the Qadar, they're from a rich Family, and they have both the Money and the Power all the way to the Capital Algiers, yet this little kid is deprived from a hug from his mother at her will.

    Also my Aunt, may ALLAH cure her, she was a fine healthy smiling woman in her mid thirties with two kids aged 5 and 3, then all of a sudden she found herself struggling with a 2nd stage breast-cancer, and went under at least 4 major surgeries, including amputations and she's still doing loads of Chemotherapy and Radiotherapy, and it's been like this for the last 2 years, and she can't even take care of herself, let alone her kids, or her husband, and the family is taking care of them, and lots of other similar cases, not mentioning that Cancer's medication is suffering from a severe scarcity in Algeria, and there are major strikes to save people's lives, and lots of stress she has to deal with on a daily basis for over continuous non-stop 24 months.

    The point is, you're still blessed with lots of ALLAH's blisses Alhamdo Lilah, and what ALLAH is testing you with will not last forever, and you shouldn't feel like you've wasted your life, or your husband's or kid's, and ALLAH SWT will only asks you about what's in your capacity, and if it's decreed upon you not to be able to take full care of your husband/kid, then you won't, either this way or the other as I stated above, so keep making Du'a and do never despair.
     
  19. AnonyMousey

    AnonyMousey Student of Life

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    Yes, I have. It's a good book, mashaAllah. It's mostly aimed at woman who want to or do work outside the home, and the challenges that they will/ do face, how to negotiate things at home, etc. It's primarily compiled from interviews with working Muslim women.
     
  20. AnonyMousey

    AnonyMousey Student of Life

    re: Let Them Eat Sandwiches! - Wifehood & Motherhood: Not the Only Ways to Paradise

    I read the original article and I agreed with it completely - and I agreed with it from the point of view of me being a stay-at-home wife and mother!

    As I have said before, and which many of us have already agreed to, wifehood and motherhood ARE incredibly difficult jobs - but they are not the ONLY roles that a Muslimah fulfills, nor are they guaranteed to take her to Paradise (unless she does a damn good job of it).
    Educating oneself in other fields, working (as long as Shar'i conditions are fulfilled), doing da'wah etc. are all extra activities from which we hope to gain extra ajr to give us that boost into Jannah, insha'Allah.

    Why are our knickers all twisted in a knot at the idea of a Muslimah - who observes hijab, who is obedient to her husband, who takes care of her children - stepping outside the home?
    (^Rhetorical question, we've had this discussion before, I know!)
     

Share This Page