Website claiming Honorary status of Pashtuns amongst Mahdi's Army

Discussion in 'Islam in General' started by Striving2Struggle, Aug 16, 2008.

  1. Striving2Struggle

    Striving2Struggle New Member

  2. Striving2Struggle

    Striving2Struggle New Member

    Thoughts? 10 char
  3. Abdullah_Al_Afghani

    Abdullah_Al_Afghani New Member

    A good reason for the Pashtun Taliban to keep up the genocide of Tajiks.
  4. Striving2Struggle

    Striving2Struggle New Member

    dunno about the Tajiks in Afghanistan, but from what I've heard the Muslim Youth and peoples in Tajikistan are very passionate about the Deen though their govt tries to oppress them.
  5. Abdullah ibn Adam

    Abdullah ibn Adam New Member

    The website mixes some authentic ahadith with other fabricated and weak ones, and some of the authentic ahadith appear to have been interpreted out of context.

    I have little doubt that many of the modern-day central asian "Muslims" (i.e. secularists/communists with Muslim names) would join the Dajjal if he appeared during our time.

    However, the writer of the articles was wrong when he claimed that the ahadith of fighting the turks (i.e. mongols, tatars, turkic ppl of central asia) do not actually refer to the mongol invasions in the middle ages.

    The ulama who have written about these issues have said that some events mentioned in the ahadith of the future events may take place more than once.

    Also, I think that his equation of the shi'ah in Iran and Afghanistan with the 70,000 jews of Isfahan mentioned in the hadith is a bit far-fetched.

    There are plenty of other websites like this, all promoting very different scenarios, each of whom selectively quotes ahadith or parts of ahadith to back them up. Some of their conclusions may be interesting at times, however for the most part they should be largely ignored.

    We should stick to the books written by the ulama about these issues, so that we can learn not only what is authentic regarding the future events, but also so that we can learn the correct approach to have towards this whole topic. That is the safest way in sha' Allah.
  6. Abu_Talha

    Abu_Talha <A HREF="showthread.php?t=70991"></A>

    Well said akhee, barakllahu feekum. I don't know why there's been a sudden surge of interest in al-Mahdi and interpretation of those ahadeeth.
  7. Abdullah ibn Adam

    Abdullah ibn Adam New Member

    It tends to happen now and again, then dies down for a while only to spring up again later...

    It is a very important issue, with which people need to be made familiar precisely so that they don't fall into the kind of misunderstandings and misinterpretations as Juhayman & co.<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->
  8. muhammad1

    muhammad1 New Member

    bismillahir rehmanir raheem
    asalamo alaykum
    The website
    has given all the ahadith with reference.
    About the Turks helping Dajjal.I think you never bothered to read the ahadith. I will write them for you
    2 ) Ahadith Mentioning The TURK Nations Of Khorasan</O>

    1) Narrated Abu Huraira: The Prophet(Salallaho alayhay wa sallam)said, "The Hour will not be established till you fight a nation wearing hairy shoes, and till you fight the Turks, who will have small eyes, red faces and flat noses; and their faces will be like flat shields. And you will find that the best people are those who hate responsibility of ruling most of all till they are chosen to be the rulers. And the people are of different natures: The best in the pre-lslamic period are the best in Islam. A time will come when any of you will love to see me rather than to have his family and property doubled."*1

    2) Narrated by Amr ibn Hurayth quoted AbuBakr as-Siddiq as saying that Allah's Messenger (Salallaho alayhay wa sallam)told themthe Dajjal would come forth from a land in the East called Khurasan, followed by people whose faces resembled shields covered with skin*2. *2..........Combining the above both Ahadith the meanind is clear that the TURK races living in Khorasan would be in the forces against Islam or in the forces of Dajjal & also its clear that these races are not the Mongols as some have wrongly interpreted the Ahadith

    ) Hazrat Buraida r.a(Companion of Dear Prophet Muhammad Salallaho alayhay wa sallam) reported that Dear Prophet Muhammad Salallaho alayhay wa sallam) said: A nation will wage war with you who will have small eyes,meaning the TURKS.You will drive them three times until you will drive them to the Arabian Peninsula .The first time you push them back ,those who will run away among them will get salvation,and in the 2<SUP>nd</SUP> time some will get salvation and some will be killed and the third time u drive them back,they will be up rooted or the way you said it.*3 </O>

    <TABLE class=MsoTableGrid style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; mso-border-alt: solid windowtext .5pt; mso-padding-alt: 0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-yfti-tbllook: 480; mso-border-insideh: .5pt solid windowtext; mso-border-insidev: .5pt solid windowtext" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=1><TBODY><TR style="mso-yfti-irow: 0; mso-yfti-lastrow: yes"><TD style="BORDER-RIGHT: windowtext 1pt solid; PADDING-RIGHT: 5.4pt; BORDER-TOP: windowtext 1pt solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5.4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: windowtext 1pt solid; WIDTH: 7.25in; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent; mso-border-alt: solid windowtext .5pt" vAlign=top width=696>
    References / Notes</O>
    *1 Ref :Bukhari Volume No: 4Book No: 56No: 787</O>
    *2 Ref :Al-Tirmidhi Hadith 5487</O>
    *3 Ref: Abu-Daood .Also Hadith No. 5195 in Mishkat-ul-Misabeeh)</O>

    About the ahadith of 70 thousand shias helping Dajjal..How can u declare a hadith fabricated just by your own imagination????
    Check also
    Asalamo alaykum
  9. Abdullah ibn Adam

    Abdullah ibn Adam New Member


    I don't deny the hadith that says that the Turks will join the Dajjal and help him. What I was trying to say is that it was wrong for the writer to clam that the general ahadith of the Turks were not referring to the mongols. The fact of the matter is that the Prophet, sallallahu 'alayhi wa-sallam, told us that the Muslims will fight against the Turks - among whom are the Mongols, Uzbeks, Turkmans and even the Koreans and Chinese - and he didn't say it was limited to a single battle or time in history. So the Muslims fought against the Gokturk Empire in the time of 'Uthman, and they fought against the Mongols in the middle ages, they will fight against the turks who are with the Dajjal, and some of them will fight against Ya'juj and Ma'juj (who are the Turks), and after Ya'juj and Ma'juj are destroyed there won't be any more Turks left to fight.

    So I'm not denying that the Turks will join the Dajjal - since most of the people in the central Asian countries in which the Turks live are soooooo far away from understanding anything about true Islam, many (perhaps most) of them are jahil secularists and communists, so it's only natural that the majority of them will go over to the Dajjal.

    Also, there is no hadith mentioning that 70,000 shi'ah will help the Dajjal. It says 70,000 jews. Jews and shi'ah are not the same thing. They might have their resemblances or similarities, sure; however the Prophet (sallallahu 'alayhi wa-sallam) clearly said "jews". He didn't say "rafidhah" or "munafiqun" or "heretics" etc., he said "jews", and when the Prophet (sallallahu 'alayhi wa-sallam) said "jews", he meant "jews". Not Christians, not majus, not shi'ah, not Hindus, not anything else. And remember that Isfahan still has a major jewish population; you could say that it is the jewish capital in Iran. No doubt many more jews will try to emigrate there after Israel collapses soon, in sha' Allah.

    BTW I didn't declare any of the ahadith fabricated "just by my own imagination". Where did you get an accusation like that from? I didn't even specify which of them were fabricated, because that would be another topic altogether, and would take a lot of time, which I don't have a lot of at the moment.

    I said that some of the ahadith mentioned on that site are fabricated because that is what major ulama of hadith have said about them.

    However I didn't say "fabricated" about the ahadith of the Turks, nor the hadith of the 70,000 jews. So I don't know where you came up with the idea that I called those particular ahadith fabricated.
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2008
  10. Abdullah ibn Adam

    Abdullah ibn Adam New Member

    Having said that, I think it is eminently possible that the Afghani pashtun mujahidun might be the victorious group of Muslims from Banu Ishaq/Banu Isra'il mentioned in the hadith in Sahih Muslim, because it is widely held that many of the Pashtun's lineages do in fact go back to the ancient tribes of Israel. So yes, it could be that this is true.

    However, there is a big difference between saying that the Pashtuns might possibly be those mentioned in the hadith on the one hand, and on the other hand declaring as if it is a matter of fact the "honorary status of the Pashtuns amongst the Mahdi's army". We need to be more careful about these kind of over-confident claims.

    This is because it is equally possible that the group of Muslims (mentioned in the hadith of Abu Hurayrah narrated by Muslim) from the descendents of Ishaq might be referring to another group. They might be the Palestinian Muslims, many of whom are descended from Ishaq's other son al-'Is, or even Jews who have converted to Islam en masse and become mujahidun... Allahu a'lam.
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2008
  11. Zarmina

    Zarmina New Member

    These kinds of websites only promote Muslim vs. Muslim. Please stay away from them. Any website or person that tell you to wage war against another Muslim is wrong. Thanks.
  12. Striving2Struggle

    Striving2Struggle New Member

    You just have to be extremely careful not to get too excited and start over-generalizing. If you do that, you will start viewing all our devout Turkic and East Asain brothers and sisters with contempt. I do not know about where the majority will stand when Dajjal appears; however, I can attest that there are very sincere East Asian Muslims in both China, Korea, and Vietnam. Mufti Muhammad Shareef (fron Sankore not Al-Maghrib) recently re-located to the Muslim autonomous regions in China and speaks quite positively about the Chinese Muslims.

    I am also pretty sure they are many devout Muslims in Central Asia, even if they are a minority. I saw a mini documentary on Hizb-ut-Tahrir in Krygystan and they were talking about how the number of hijabis has rapidly increased over the years and how the mosques are a lot more crowded than before.

    There were similar reports about how the President of Tajikistan was complaining that the Muslim youth were not spending enough time studying for school during the month of Ramadan, because they were frequenting the masjid.

    I do not mean to undermine the ahadith, but we must be careful not to paint all Turkics and East Asian Muslims with the same brush. One obvious reason is that Islam is still relatively new to many of these people, as these countries were staunchyly Communist and anti-religion until the past 15 years. During the Communism period the people were forced to forget their Islamic identity and could only be Muslim by name similar to Bosnia.

    Also take into account that the authro of the site is likely a Proud Pasthoon himself so there is a chance he could be bias against the Central Asians.

    And Allah SWT Knows Best
  13. muhammad1

    muhammad1 New Member

    for Abdullah ibn Adam

    bismillahir rehmanir raheem
    asalamo alaykum
    I never declared all of the Turks.....and whom am I to declare? Cant u see what the hadith is clearly telling? I think u never bothred to check the ahadith and the meaning after u combine them

    About the 70 thousand said that the word SHIA is not were no shias at the time of Dear Prophet Muhammad Salallaho alayhay wa the clear hint is given in the hadith...check this hadith
    1)Hazrat Abu-saeed Khudri r.a(Companion of Dear Prophet Muhammad Salallaho alayhay wa sallam) reported that Dear Prophet Muhammad Salallaho alayhay wa sallam) said: Seventy thousand people from my Ummah will follow Dajjal and black sheets *1 of cloth will be placed on their Shoulders.*2 .

    THE WORD 70 thousand people from my ummah is written here and now come to the 2nd hadith
    2) Hazrat Anass r.a(Companion of Dear Prophet Muhammad Salallaho alayhay wa sallam) reported that Dear Prophet Muhammad Salallaho alayhay wa sallam) said:” 70 thousand jews of Esphahan will follow Dajjal and they will have black sheets of cloth over them”*3

    NOW combine the meaning of both ahadith and u will get the pic
    *1 Note: Only the Shia Sect in the Ummah have black cloaks placed/dropped on their shoulders. Check the Irani Shia Clerics .</O>
    *2 Ref; Narrated by Sharh-as-Sunnah. Hadith No 5254 in Mishkat-ul-Misabeeh) </O>
    *3 Ref: Saheeh Muslim. Also Hadith No 5242 Mishkat-ul-Masaeeh.

    check the site again

    asalamo alaykum

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